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ION - Waterloo Region's Light Rail Transit - Printable Version

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RE: ION - Waterloo Region's Light Rail Transit - danbrotherston - 01-20-2018

(01-20-2018, 09:00 PM)ijmorlan Wrote:
(01-20-2018, 06:23 PM)trainspotter139 Wrote: That would explain the gauge checking on the other curves.

It is a good thing that they found this no matter when it was found. a curve that is out by a few millimetres would cause too much wear on the bogies, make a lot of squealing noise or cause a train to derail.

My question would be why is this finally getting detected and fixed now. Given that service was supposed to start last year, shouldn’t the tracks and other system components have been ready for LRVs in advance of the originally-planned opening day? Gauge checking should have been done at most weeks after the initial track installation and the corrections could have been made a year ago. Why the lack of urgency throughout this entire project? This part isn’t Bombardier’s fault.

This is my thoughts, this substantially weakens the claim that if we only had trains, we'd have been running them.  There seems to be a lack of hurrying to get this train on the tracks as it were.

RE: ION - Waterloo Region's Light Rail Transit - Pheidippides - 01-21-2018

Was it that the rail out of position because of the position it was embedded in or out of position because the pre-curving wasn't done properly to specifications?

Apologies for the lack of construction knowledge, but exactly what is the fix here?

Aren't all the tracks welded together now? How do you just fix one section of track without affecting the two end points of where everything is in alignment?

Won't they have to cut the troubled section out, remove the entire curve, and put it or a new piece back in the right position? Do they just heat it up and bang in to position?

It interesting that this was not caught before. I know I saw them checking that curve before. It was right around the time the had to shave off and re-pour some of the platform edges. Is it even possible with all the reinforcing that something simply heaved in the cold weather?

RE: ION - Waterloo Region's Light Rail Transit - Canard - 01-21-2018

(01-20-2018, 06:23 PM)trainspotter139 Wrote: a curve that is out by a few millimetres would cause too much wear on the bogies, make a lot of squealing noise or cause a train to derail.

A few millimetres absolutely won't cause a derailment.  The distance between the flanges on our trains is 10 mm less than the nominal distance between rail heads (1425 vs. 1435 mm).  The width of the running surfaces of the wheels on trams is much wider than conventional rail vehicles, because of what happens when you put a set of axles on a long fixed wheelbase through a sharp curve.  The issue is simply one of contractual agreement and paperwork, and nothing more.

   

   
From the Project Agreement, Schedule 15-2, Section 12.5, paragraph a)

Tolerances are given in Schedule 15-2, Section 12.8, paragraph b), and show a -0/+3.0 mm tolerance for gauge of rails at construction:

   

(01-20-2018, 09:00 PM)ijmorlan Wrote: Why the lack of urgency throughout this entire project? This part isn’t Bombardier’s fault.

(01-20-2018, 09:03 PM)danbrotherston Wrote: This is my thoughts, this substantially weakens the claim that if we only had trains, we'd have been running them.  There seems to be a lack of hurrying to get this train on the tracks as it were.

I've had the same thoughts, and feel the same way, for what its worth.  Undecided  I keep trying to put my thoughts together - everyone's so livid with Bombardier, but redirecting anger (even when it's unfairly aimed) doesn't solve anything.

(01-21-2018, 12:01 AM)Pheidippides Wrote: Was it that the rail out of position because of the position it was embedded in or out of position because the pre-curving wasn't done properly to specifications?

We don't know.

Quote:Apologies for the lack of construction knowledge, but exactly what is the fix here?

It would depend on if it's too close or too far out, I think, and by how much.  Now that the tent is up, it's not easy to see what technique they're using.  Best bet is to talk with one of them and ask.

Quote:Aren't all the tracks welded together now?

Yes!

Quote:How do you just fix one section of track without affecting the two end points of where everything is in alignment?

I've had the same thought.  They've exposed the rail through the curve, but it's still fixed at both ends.  Forcing it winder in one part will force it narrower in the adjacent parts.

Quote:Won't they have to cut the troubled section out, remove the entire curve, and put it or a new piece back in the right position?

I doubt it, for a few millimetres.

Quote:Do they just heat it up and bang in to position?

I suspect so, or they might cut it somewhere, and either:
  • use the blade thickness of the saw for that single cut to pull the rails tighter
  • make a second cut and remove a small segment to pull the rails tighter
  • force the rails further apart, and fill the gap with weld, to push the rails further apart

Quote:It interesting that this was not caught before. I know I saw them checking that curve before. It was right around the time the had to shave off and re-pour some of the platform edges. Is it even possible with all the reinforcing that something simply heaved in the cold weather?

This is plausible.  I also can't help but wonder if it's two different people who were operating the gauging cart at different times, with different interpretations of what is within tolerance or out of.

I work in the automation industry, and we build massive machines from raw materials.  I design (and chase) my projects through from start to finish.  When we have to do something out-of-house (like big weldment frames), a supplier will sometimes call me up and say "I welded this pad 5 mm out of position.  Can you live with that, or do I need to grind the weld off and move it?"  I take a look at what's critical, if it actually matters or not... and most of the time, it doesn't.  Even though it's technically out of tolerance from my drawing, I'm not going to be a jerk and make the guy spend hours re-doing something that I know in the end really won't matter.

(I appreciate this is different, but I'm really curious just how far out of tolerance they are!)

RE: ION - Waterloo Region's Light Rail Transit - Canard - 01-21-2018

Stages of grouting work:

   

   

   

RE: ION - Waterloo Region's Light Rail Transit - Canard - 01-21-2018

Mods - please feel free to use any photo I’ve ever posted if you like, to update the front page. Seems like whatever images were there are broken!

   

(I’d be happy to submit/email you some recommendations if it’s easier)

RE: ION - Waterloo Region's Light Rail Transit - Canard - 01-21-2018

(01-12-2018, 09:40 PM)Pheidippides Wrote: Update on Ion art installations coming 19-Jan-2018.

Where can I find an archived webcast, or minutes, for this meeting?  I would like an update on the artwork projects, but can't seem to find it.

RE: ION - Waterloo Region's Light Rail Transit - Pheidippides - 01-21-2018

I don't think that particular sub-committee is recorded and the minutes probably won't be out until they are approved at the next meeting.

Your best chance is asking someone who was in attendance (general public, councillor, or media).

RE: ION - Waterloo Region's Light Rail Transit - Canard - 01-21-2018

Nooooooo Sad So it wasn't webcast? Shouldn't these things be public and accessible? Surely a record is available?

RE: ION - Waterloo Region's Light Rail Transit - KevinL - 01-21-2018

Not for such a small subcommittee. There's rarely enough public interest.

RE: ION - Waterloo Region's Light Rail Transit - Bob_McBob - 01-21-2018

(01-21-2018, 05:17 PM)Canard Wrote: Mods - please feel free to use any photo I’ve ever posted if you like, to update the front page. Seems like whatever images were there are broken!



(I’d be happy to submit/email you some recommendations if it’s easier)

Here are the original images if an admin would like to edit the post. Photobucket broke untold numbers of images in forum posts and other locations with their ransom demands in the summer.

http://www.bbc.com/news/technology-40492668

[Image: oUjWBXd.jpg]

[Image: Be0dXR5.jpg]

[Image: S9kSqVG.jpg]


RE: ION - Waterloo Region's Light Rail Transit - tomh009 - 01-22-2018

Thanks. Fixed now.

RE: ION - Waterloo Region's Light Rail Transit - Canard - 01-22-2018

Project team is preparing an “official” update about the art projects.

RE: ION - Waterloo Region's Light Rail Transit - Canard - 01-23-2018

Drove by the OMSF at about 9am. No yard activity, and the gates were closed - but the red lamp was ON on the OCS pole adjacent Northfield at the curve onto the spur! It’s the first time I’ve noticed it on.

Perhaps a good sign for some activity today a little later?

RE: ION - Waterloo Region's Light Rail Transit - trainspotter139 - 01-23-2018

(01-23-2018, 10:56 AM)Canard Wrote: Drove by the OMSF at about 9am. No yard activity, and the gates were closed - but the red lamp was ON on the OCS pole adjacent Northfield at the curve onto the spur! It’s the first time I’ve noticed it on.

Perhaps a good sign for some activity today a little later?

Kevin T posted a photo in the Facebook group of 504 on the spur under power but stationary.

RE: ION - Waterloo Region's Light Rail Transit - KevinT - 01-23-2018

Spotted Ion LRV 504 outside the yard under its own power this morning:

[Image: 28078755879_3df9557744_b.jpg]

This is a first for any of the region's vehicles as far as I know.  I couldn't hang around to catch it moving, but passed the Bearinger Rd crossing on my way into work and noted that police cars were waiting for it, and the external disconnect switches at the Traction Power Substation there were flipped ON for the first time I'd ever seen.  (I check most every weekday morning, and they've always been padlocked OFF.)  The power lights on the OCS poles were still off at the time, the automation probably had to flip the switches inside of the TPSS yet.

It's happening!