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Region of Waterloo International Airport - YKF - Printable Version

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RE: Region of Waterloo International Airport - YKF - chutten - 07-21-2015

(07-21-2015, 02:53 PM)BuildingScout Wrote: Sure, one will never fly YKF-Singapore direct, but why exactly we cannot have direct flights to Calgary, Vancouver, New York, Chicago, Dublin and San Francisco? I bet the demand is there.

Uh, we _do_ have direct flights from YKF to Calgary and Chicago. Daily.

SF, NYC, Vancouver I can see demand... but Dublin? I'd expect Ottawa service to return, first.


RE: Region of Waterloo International Airport - YKF - Markster - 07-21-2015

(07-21-2015, 01:15 PM)ookpik Wrote: 2. GO train? (The existing line runs about 1km from YYZ. Either add a spur line or a shuttle service. And of course we'd need hourly service.)
A spur already exists. You can transfer at Weston to the UPX. The real problem is that GO Train service is quite lacking. The GO+UPX fare is one of the most affordable options from Kitchener.


RE: Region of Waterloo International Airport - YKF - tomh009 - 07-21-2015

(07-21-2015, 02:53 PM)BuildingScout Wrote:
(07-21-2015, 02:19 PM)ookpik Wrote: One reason why expansion at YKF is impractical from a business standpoint is due the immense benefit and value of flying through a hub.

Sure, one will never fly YKF-Singapore direct, but why exactly we cannot have direct flights to Calgary, Vancouver, New York, Chicago, Dublin and San Francisco? I bet the demand is there.

If the demand is really there, why is no one doing point-to-point flights from YKF?  The costs are low, there are plenty of landing slots, there is no competition.  Are all the airline planners and strategists completely unaware that airports other than YYZ exist?


(07-21-2015, 02:49 PM)BuildingScout Wrote:
(07-21-2015, 02:33 PM)tomh009 Wrote: And in addition to that, expansion at YKF (or YHM, or YXU) is no substitute for YYZ capacity.

I don't follow. Stanstead, Gatwick and Luton have expanded to relieve pressure from Heathrow. Why would the same effect not apply here for YYZ?

Stanstead, Gatwick and Luton are there only because Heathrow is so constrained (no landing slots available and no room for expansion).  This is not the case at YYZ.


RE: Region of Waterloo International Airport - YKF - BuildingScout - 07-21-2015

(07-21-2015, 02:59 PM)chutten Wrote:
(07-21-2015, 02:53 PM)BuildingScout Wrote: Sure, one will never fly YKF-Singapore direct, but why exactly we cannot have direct flights to Calgary, Vancouver, New York, Chicago, Dublin and San Francisco? I bet the demand is there.

Uh, we _do_ have direct flights from YKF to Calgary and Chicago. Daily.

I know.


Quote:SF, NYC, Vancouver I can see demand... but Dublin? I'd expect Ottawa service to return, first.

Dublin is the Ryanair hub. There are over 50K low budget travelers in the region who would be happy to fly to Dublin connecting with Ryanair to their final European destination.

Heck, half the time I have to stop over in Frankfurt, Heathrow, Charles de Gaulle or Schiphol on my way to my final European destination. Why not stop in Dublin instead and save a pretty penny in the process?


RE: Region of Waterloo International Airport - YKF - BuildingScout - 07-21-2015

(07-21-2015, 03:01 PM)tomh009 Wrote: If the demand is really there, why is no one doing point-to-point flights from YKF?  The costs are low, there are plenty of landing slots, there is no competition.  Are all the airline planners and strategists completely unaware that airports other than YYZ exist?

Vancouver and Calgary are already there, as is Chicago. However it takes a long time to build ridership. Some of my oft traveling colleagues were unaware of the YKF option to ORD until I mentioned to them earlier this year(!).


RE: Region of Waterloo International Airport - YKF - Canard - 07-21-2015

An LRT extension to the airport along Victoria (or Fairway) would be a great start. The "Last Mile" problem. The airport isn't served by public transport. Chicken or egg.


RE: Region of Waterloo International Airport - YKF - kps - 07-21-2015

(07-21-2015, 11:24 AM)tomh009 Wrote: The costs of flying from YKF will already be far lower than YYZ

If ticket prices reflected that, people from Toronto would come here to fly, just like they drive to Buffalo to fly.


RE: Region of Waterloo International Airport - YKF - BuildingScout - 07-21-2015

(07-21-2015, 04:33 PM)kps Wrote:
(07-21-2015, 11:24 AM)tomh009 Wrote: The costs of flying from YKF will already be far lower than YYZ

If ticket prices reflected that, people from Toronto would come here to fly, just like they drive to Buffalo to fly.

As people used to do back when WestJet flew from Hamilton.


RE: Region of Waterloo International Airport - YKF - YKF - 07-21-2015

(07-21-2015, 02:33 PM)tomh009 Wrote:
(07-21-2015, 01:45 PM)BuildingScout Wrote: To the contrary, YYZ is bursting at the seems and expansion there is way more expensive than expansion at YKF.

Bursting at the seams?  Certainly not.  There were 32M pax last year, with a capacity of 35M (21M for T1 and 14M for T3).  There is another 4M of overflow capacity by using the infield terminal (currently not in use since the last phase of T1 was completed).  The next T1 expansion is slated to open about 2020, and will bring the airport capacity to over 50M pax.

And in addition to that, expansion at YKF (or YHM, or YXU) is no substitute for YYZ capacity.

You're slightly off. YYZ handled over 38M pax in 2014 and they still have room to accommodate a few million more without any terminal expansions. By no means is YYZ in 'bursting at the seams' territory. A friend of mine who works for GTAA stated that before T1 gets its new pier, they'll be adding capacity by reconfiguring the terminals (currently underway in T3) and moving airlines from T3 to T1 if need be.


RE: Region of Waterloo International Airport - YKF - tomh009 - 07-21-2015

(07-21-2015, 07:25 PM)YKF Wrote:
(07-21-2015, 02:33 PM)tomh009 Wrote: Bursting at the seams?  Certainly not.  There were 32M pax last year, with a capacity of 35M (21M for T1 and 14M for T3).  There is another 4M of overflow capacity by using the infield terminal (currently not in use since the last phase of T1 was completed).  The next T1 expansion is slated to open about 2020, and will bring the airport capacity to over 50M pax.

And in addition to that, expansion at YKF (or YHM, or YXU) is no substitute for YYZ capacity.

You're slightly off. YYZ handled over 38M pax in 2014 and they still have room to accommodate a few million more without any terminal expansions. By no means is YYZ in 'bursting at the seams' territory. A friend of mine who works for GTAA stated that before T1 gets its new pier, they'll be adding capacity by reconfiguring the terminals (currently underway in T3) and moving airlines from T3 to T1 if need be.

This is what I get from reading outdated planning documents! Big Grin


RE: Region of Waterloo International Airport - YKF - DHLawrence - 07-21-2015

Does anyone know if YKF GM joined up here after WW crashed and burned?


RE: Region of Waterloo International Airport - YKF - panamaniac - 07-21-2015

(07-21-2015, 10:50 PM)DHLawrence Wrote: Does anyone know if YKF GM joined up here after WW crashed and burned?

Post #15.


RE: Region of Waterloo International Airport - YKF - taylortbb - 07-21-2015

I think BuildingScout nailed it. People simply aren't aware of YKF as an option. I flew YKF-ORD-SFO last year, and of the ~30 people I told about my trip 28 were surprised I could fly from Waterloo. Many people living in KW didn't even know we had an airport with commercial service, much less had any idea where it flew to. Everyone I talked to in Toronto was shocked that YKF existed, even the ones that hate Pearson due to its size and would happily drive to YKF.


RE: Region of Waterloo International Airport - YKF - tomh009 - 07-22-2015

(07-21-2015, 11:32 PM)taylortbb Wrote: I think BuildingScout nailed it. People simply aren't aware of YKF as an option. I flew YKF-ORD-SFO last year, and of the ~30 people I told about my trip 28 were surprised I could fly from Waterloo. Many people living in KW didn't even know we had an airport with commercial service, much less had any idea where it flew to. Everyone I talked to in Toronto was shocked that YKF existed, even the ones that hate Pearson due to its size and would happily drive to YKF.

Yes, you can do YKF-ORD-SFO (and tons of other connections through ORD).

For me personally, though, I will always prefer a direct flight over a connection: less hassle, less risk of delays (missed connections), and less risk of lost luggage if you do check luggage.  And ORD is one of my least favourite airports.

And the direct will almost always be quicker, even with the drive to YYZ: tomorrow, I have basically one option from YKF: depart YKF at 07:00, connect ORD, arrive SFO at 12:40.  From YYZ, I can depart at 08:00, and arrive SFO at 10:25, more than two hours earlier.  And departure time from my house would not be all that much different as the flight leaves an hour later.  (And there are five other direct flights later in the day.)

Finally, if AA is not your preferred airline, then the YKF-ORD connection is much less desirable.

So, yes, you can fly from YKF to almost anywhere.  But it'll be with a connection using AA through ORD, and everything that comes with that.


RE: Region of Waterloo International Airport - YKF - SammyOES - 07-22-2015

I'd love to fly out of YKF, as its a super convenient airport.  But I'm willing to put up with YYZ for a direct flight if my alternative is a connection when flying out of YKF (especially if that connection is Chicago in the Winter).  The other problem is flexibility.  If I'm flying to NYC there are 30 to 40 flights to choose from out of YYZ.  Even if YKF offered a direct flight it would have to be at a time that I could make work.  

Talking about public transport like a light rail going to the airport is extremely premature.  At this point you could probably offer an occasional bus service (maybe timed to the bigger flights) and get the same results for much less money.  But even then I doubt adding public transportation adds much to the demand for YKF.