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ION - Waterloo Region's Light Rail Transit
Ion trains being checked after welding defect found on Toronto streetcars
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It's hard to tell at this time if it will affect the ION trains or not. While the frames were made in the Mexico plant, they are a different model, so the defect may not exist. Even if it does, it should not delay the launch any more than it is already delayed. If they need to be fixed, I imagine they will look at it when they expand the fleet to double trains.
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(07-04-2018, 03:54 PM)bgb_ca Wrote: It's hard to tell at this time if it will affect the ION trains or not. While the frames were made in the Mexico plant, they are a different model, so the defect may not exist. Even if it does, it should not delay the launch any more than it is already delayed. If they need to be fixed, I imagine they will look at it when they expand the fleet to double trains.

That's not my understanding. It's a fairly serious defect (though not a safety issue) which would shorten the lifespan of the train if not repaired. I am thinking the trains, if defective, would need to be repaired first before running them out full-time, although with Toronto they have enough spares to be able to keep their LRT in services. It's going to take them 4 years to repair.

Hopefully, this isn't an issue with our trains, and if it is, I don't understand how a welding process could take so long, but obviously, I am naive when it comes to repairs on these trains.

Guess we'll find out in a month or two before we figure if this is a setback.
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(07-04-2018, 04:56 PM)jeffster Wrote:
(07-04-2018, 03:54 PM)bgb_ca Wrote: It's hard to tell at this time if it will affect the ION trains or not. While the frames were made in the Mexico plant, they are a different model, so the defect may not exist. Even if it does, it should not delay the launch any more than it is already delayed. If they need to be fixed, I imagine they will look at it when they expand the fleet to double trains.

That's not my understanding. It's a fairly serious defect (though not a safety issue) which would shorten the lifespan of the train if not repaired. I am thinking the trains, if defective, would need to be repaired first before running them out full-time, although with Toronto they have enough spares to be able to keep their LRT in services. It's going to take them 4 years to repair.

Hopefully, this isn't an issue with our trains, and if it is, I don't understand how a welding process could take so long, but obviously, I am naive when it comes to repairs on these trains.

Guess we'll find out in a month or two before we figure if this is a setback.

the fix takes so long because they have to fully disassemble the vehicles to redo the welds then fully reassemble the vehicles.
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(07-04-2018, 05:06 PM)trainspotter139 Wrote: the fix takes so long because they have to fully disassemble the vehicles to redo the welds then fully reassemble the vehicles.

Wow, eh? Just got to hope this doesn't change the timing of the start-up date, but I can't see how it won't. I think we need 12 trains for full services, with 2 spares, until we start getting another shipment of trains, which I think is still a few years away. The only option is to send in 1 train at a time, and have only 1 spare, assuming our trains are defective, which is a very good chance they are.
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(07-04-2018, 06:13 PM)jeffster Wrote:
(07-04-2018, 05:06 PM)trainspotter139 Wrote: the fix takes so long because they have to fully disassemble the vehicles to redo the welds then fully reassemble the vehicles.

Wow, eh? Just got to hope this doesn't change the timing of the start-up date, but I can't see how it won't. I think we need 12 trains for full services, with 2 spares, until we start getting another shipment of trains, which I think is still a few years away. The only option is to send in 1 train at a time, and have only 1 spare, assuming our trains are defective, which is a very good chance they are.

Why do you think there's a very good chance all our trains are defective? Weren't most of the frames built in Canada?
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(07-04-2018, 06:20 PM)Bob_McBob Wrote:
(07-04-2018, 06:13 PM)jeffster Wrote: Wow, eh? Just got to hope this doesn't change the timing of the start-up date, but I can't see how it won't. I think we need 12 trains for full services, with 2 spares, until we start getting another shipment of trains, which I think is still a few years away. The only option is to send in 1 train at a time, and have only 1 spare, assuming our trains are defective, which is a very good chance they are.

Why do you think there's a very good chance all our trains are defective? Weren't most of the frames built in Canada?

They were. in the very same plant that will be doing the rewelding on the TTC Streetcars
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(07-04-2018, 06:20 PM)Bob_McBob Wrote:
(07-04-2018, 06:13 PM)jeffster Wrote: Wow, eh? Just got to hope this doesn't change the timing of the start-up date, but I can't see how it won't. I think we need 12 trains for full services, with 2 spares, until we start getting another shipment of trains, which I think is still a few years away. The only option is to send in 1 train at a time, and have only 1 spare, assuming our trains are defective, which is a very good chance they are.

Why do you think there's a very good chance all our trains are defective? Weren't most of the frames built in Canada?

Were the frames for the TTC built in a different plant than the ones for the ION?

Also, is this simply a workmanship flaw, or is it a design flaw that might persist with the ION?

Whatever the case, there is an "Off Topic" discussion about the TTC over at redflagdeals, apparently each train would take 19 weeks to repair.
https://forums.redflagdeals.com/re-call-...s-2205345/
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Jeffster, all the information you're looking for was in Ben's Star article.

2 weeks to travel to Quebec
12 weeks to repair
2 weeks to travel back
3 weeks of recomissioning
= 19 weeks

The TTC frames were primarily built in Bombardier's (acquired) plant in Sahagun, Mexico. After a number of problems in Thunder Bay fitting the frame elements together, they switched production to their plant at La Pocatiere, Quebec ("The Poke"). I think 501's frame (and the first two ML pilots) came from Sahagun, but our 502-514 were all fabbed in The Poke.

If something was wrong with 501, one would hope it would have been rectified when it was sent to Millhaven to match the others in the fleet.

On a positive note, 508 was loaded up today, and is about to head our way.
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(07-04-2018, 08:33 PM)jeffster Wrote:
(07-04-2018, 06:20 PM)Bob_McBob Wrote: Why do you think there's a very good chance all our trains are defective? Weren't most of the frames built in Canada?

Were the frames for the TTC built in a different plant than the ones for the ION?

Also, is this simply a workmanship flaw, or is it a design flaw that might persist with the ION?

Whatever the case, there is an "Off Topic" discussion about the TTC over at redflagdeals, apparently each train would take 19 weeks to repair.
https://forums.redflagdeals.com/re-call-...s-2205345/

1. For vehicles 502-514 I'm pretty sure the answer is yes.
2. It was a workmanship flaw from the Sahagun plant's welders (who had high employee turnover for the longest time) 
3. 4 weeks of that is shipping to/from La Pocatiere, 3 weeks is for recommissioning. The actual repair is a 12 week period. Source: https://twitter.com/BenSpurr/status/1014599713432227841
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(07-04-2018, 08:37 PM)Canard Wrote: On a positive note, 508 was loaded up today, and is about to head our way.

Yay!!!
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Making it a little harder for motorists not to notice the tracks in Uptown:
   
   
   

And expanding the sidewalk and eliminating a common illegal parking spot in front of McCabe's:
   
Everyone move to the back of the bus and we all get home faster.
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(07-04-2018, 08:37 PM)Canard Wrote: On a positive note, 508 was loaded up today, and is about to head our way.

Does that mean that the Grandlinq equipment has been installed? Or it will be done here?
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No, they don't have the specialized equipment installed.
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I guess 508 coming here will give us seven sets here, and another seven at Bombardier, so the work for the equipment install can be balanced between the two locations. And I am going to assume that the "specialized" equipment (isn't most of the equipment on our LRT specialized anyway?) hasn't arrived yet so its install hasn't started yet.

What's the correct term for this "specialized equipment" that we are waiting for? Signaling and communication equipment? Something else?
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