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St. Patrick's celebrations
#1
No more street party on Ezra for St. Patrick’s Day, says police chief

Quote:Larkin won't say how many uniformed and plain-clothes officers will be on the streets but at this week's police services board meeting, board members approved a plan to bring in the public safety unit from Peel Regional Police.

That means in addition to local officers, police from Peel Regional will be on hand that date.

It's the first time local police have asked for help from another police service.
My Twitter: @KevinLMaps
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#2
It will be interesting to see how things play out.
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#3
Terrible terrible terrible approach... this will just lead to a clash between students and police. Banning a celebration that students love is never a good idea. They just need to be present but not overbearing and let the students have fun...
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#4
What a misleading headline.
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#5
(02-23-2018, 11:16 AM)urbd Wrote: Terrible terrible terrible approach... this will just lead to a clash between students and police. Banning a celebration that students love is never a good idea. They just need to be present but not overbearing and let the students have fun...

Considering the city spends six figures to unsuccessfully police it, Laurier spends another five figures to police it, the city spends another six figures to try to offer alternative events, and still we wind up with massive property damage (I recall hearing that one building's elevator was rendered inoperable), this isn't trending in the right direction. The "speak softly" policing approach hasn't worked, and so the "carry a big stick" version is completely understandable. Anyone obeying laws has nothing to fear; I don't think we should suspend our laws because a bunch of people don't want to follow them.
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#6
"anyone obeying the law has nothing to worry". They're shutting down the event for everyone, including law abiders. That is a real harm.

Also, just because existing policies have had problems (of arguable degree) doesn't mean the stick is the right option and almost certainly will fail.
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#7
Shutting down a street (and a residential side street at that) for a public event is not a harm.

Edit: I misread Dan's comment and I thought he was saying that shutting down the street was harmful, instead of shutting down the event. Sorry about that.
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#8
As far as anyone has said, "shutting down" means no longer looking the other way about lawbreaking, like last year where the Police Chief would chat with underage people drinking openly on the street. The police certainly have zero ability to stop you enjoying beers in your home, but if you're underage drinking, if you're selling alcohol without a licence, etc, well...
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#9
The "public safety unit" is doublespeak for the riot control police. I think people going out and drinking is all well and good but taking over a street and turning it into a giant piss-up is pretty stupid. It's not about having fun and few drinks anymore... I'm surprised this didn't happen the year after the riots in London. Especially considering the size of the event and crowded conditions it wouldn't take much for it to become very dangerous.
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#10
You've got to think it just spreads elsewhere?

But the question becomes, how draconian do they become when it comes to enforcement?
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#11
(02-23-2018, 11:16 AM)urbd Wrote: Terrible terrible terrible approach... this will just lead to a clash between students and police. Banning a celebration that students love is never a good idea. They just need to be present but not overbearing and let the students have fun...

"this will just lead to a clash between students and police." for which all those adults need to know there will be consequences.

Why should (we?) the public pay $45,000 per year for students who believe it is their moral right to party wherever they want and to have no understanding of their behaviour ... "kids" just want to have fun is way past where this has gotten to.
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#12
Not against celebrating St. Pats but realistically: Pretty sure the insurance companies aren't happy with things like elevator repair bills, or any other associated property damage.

Students can still have fun, but AFAIK walking down the middle of a public street with open container is a ticketable offense. Multiply that by a whole street/neighborhood and the fines will offset some of the costs associated.

I get it, we've all been there. A lot of things are learned in life and perhaps responsibility is one of the more important ones
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#13
I don't really understand the hard line approach to this party - from a cost, nuisance, or safety perspective - when Oktoberfest is one of the Region's major tourist events.
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#14
So the Region should embrace and formalize the practice? Legalize, don't prohibit?

I like it.

One problem may be the lack of indoor venues in the area. Another might be the lack of cultural through-line that Berlin has with Oktoberfest. This is not an Irish celebration. It is a celebration of green and beer.

But neither of those should be deal-breakers. A more mercenary Council would already have leapt on this.
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#15
(03-02-2018, 06:02 PM)chutten Wrote: So the Region should embrace and formalize the practice? Legalize, don't prohibit?

I like it.

One problem may be the lack of indoor venues in the area. Another might be the lack of cultural through-line that Berlin has with Oktoberfest. This is not an Irish celebration. It is a celebration of green and beer.

But neither of those should be deal-breakers. A more mercenary Council would already have leapt on this.

Didn’t they run sanctioned beer tents a year or two ago? That is sort of like starting down that path.

I was trying to think of objections, but I ended up with something like “St. Paddy’s day is well-known as an opportunity to get hammered, whereas Oktoberfest is understood to be a time of wine tasting alternated with poetry readings”. So I think I’m coming to the view that setting up a structure like that used for Oktobertfest could work. Am I right in believing that almost everybody views Oktoberfest as primarily a benefit or at worst a neutral for the Region? I’m sure some people get drunk and there are probably a few arrests for various related incidents, but I can’t recall it ever being a big problem or anybody concluding that we should cancel. The same approach might well work for St. Paddy’s. The worst offenders probably want a confrontation with the police anyway. If all the normal people who just want to have a good time (and yes, for many of them, get drunk, but not create havoc) are at proper venues the trouble makers probably won’t even show up.
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