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SIXO Midtown | 28 + 20? + 12? + ? fl | Proposed
(04-07-2016, 08:31 AM)panamaniac Wrote: I suspect that the eventual development will address the retaining wall issue.  As far as I know, what we're looking at so far is one of several concepts for the eventual development.  What finally gets built may bear little or no ressemblance....

No, this was the concept chosen among a few options by Zehr Group to develop on the site. But yes, expect significant changes as this goes through the approval process... and hopefully it's not watered down to the point of mediocrity as we've seen before with other projects.
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(04-07-2016, 07:33 AM)jamincan Wrote: My primary concern is that there doesn't seem to be a sidewalk connection through the site due to the access ramps off King forcing pedestrians to divert significantly into the site or onto that second level.

That is my single point of issue. I don't mind the retaining wall, if they can keep a direct, straight, barrier-free pedestrian throughway at the level of their shops.
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(04-07-2016, 08:55 AM)insider Wrote:
(04-07-2016, 08:31 AM)panamaniac Wrote: I suspect that the eventual development will address the retaining wall issue.  As far as I know, what we're looking at so far is one of several concepts for the eventual development.  What finally gets built may bear little or no ressemblance....

No, this was the concept chosen among a few options by Zehr Group to develop on the site. But yes, expect significant changes as this goes through the approval process... and hopefully it's not watered down to the point of mediocrity as we've seen before with other projects.

I did not know that - has there been public confirmation of this somewhere?
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This project reminds me of City Centre in Las Vegas. It has a bunch of raised sidewalks and I find it terrible to get around. Stairs everywhere.

Hopefully whatever is done with King's Crossing will be pedestrian friendly.
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I really don't see stairs as pedestrian unfriendly (though not accessible -- need ramps or elevators for wheelchair access). The site has significant elevation changes and stairs are usually the best solution for those as they take much less space than ramps.

For pedestrians walking by along King St, the stairs and internal layout don't matter much anyway. If the building looks nice and the retaining wall can be eliminated (or made more interesting, with display windows, for example), not much else should matter.

For people living, working or shopping at King's Crossing, the layout will be relevant. Access to/from the street to/from retail and residential towers will be the key, but speed of access will need to be balanced with site design/architecture/landscaping to make it an attractive and pleasant place to live, work and shop. From that point of view, there are probably optimizations that can be done, but even for that, I really don't see it as being terrible.
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(04-07-2016, 07:33 AM)jamincan Wrote: It does seem exactly like a cruise ship. And I strongly dislike it. My primary concern is that there doesn't seem to be a sidewalk connection through the site due to the access ramps off King forcing pedestrians to divert significantly into the site or onto that second level.

Sidewalk connection through the site ... from where to where?  To do a shortcut from King to Wellington?
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(04-07-2016, 07:16 AM)REnerd Wrote: Personally, I think this looks like a condo crossed with a shopping mall crossed with a cruise ship.  It looks terribly dysfunctional from a streetscape point of view.

Why is it dysfunctional?  Apart from the retaining wall, which has already been much discussed, and which will hopefully be improved yet.
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(04-07-2016, 12:23 PM)tomh009 Wrote:
(04-07-2016, 07:16 AM)REnerd Wrote: Personally, I think this looks like a condo crossed with a shopping mall crossed with a cruise ship.  It looks terribly dysfunctional from a streetscape point of view.

Why is it dysfunctional?  Apart from the retaining wall, which has already been much discussed, and which will hopefully be improved yet.

Dysfunctional because I disagree with your above sentiment about stairs.  Retail customers are notoriously fickle.  Customers barely want to open doors let alone climb a set of stairs to your shop.

Just my opinion... obviously lots of people see this differently.
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(04-06-2016, 09:28 PM)Elmira Guy Wrote: Link to this topic on SSP.

http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/showthre...3&page=290

Some of the other threads can be fairly combative so be warned. There are a lot of geographically insecure people there.

replace stairs with escalators lol
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Not sure why you quoted my post with your comment, jordan2423. Doesn't seem to make a lot of sense, but then hey. I went to Laurier for my undergrad. What do I know?
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(04-07-2016, 01:41 PM)Elmira Guy Wrote: Not sure why you quoted my post with your comment, jordan2423. Doesn't seem to make a lot of sense, but then hey. I went to Laurier for my undergrad. What do I know?

I obviously quoted the wrong person.
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(04-07-2016, 12:22 PM)tomh009 Wrote:
(04-07-2016, 07:33 AM)jamincan Wrote: It does seem exactly like a cruise ship. And I strongly dislike it. My primary concern is that there doesn't seem to be a sidewalk connection through the site due to the access ramps off King forcing pedestrians to divert significantly into the site or onto that second level.

Sidewalk connection through the site ... from where to where?  To do a shortcut from King to Wellington?

For walking along King.  So that you can walk along King, and not have to choose between a long walk between traffic and a retaining wall or a long detour into the complex.  If there is an unbroken path at complex level, people will walk along that for the visual interest and separation from traffic, but if it requires a large detour, then people are stuck with making a choice between two unfavourable options.
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(04-07-2016, 02:36 PM)Markster Wrote:
(04-07-2016, 12:22 PM)tomh009 Wrote: Sidewalk connection through the site ... from where to where?  To do a shortcut from King to Wellington?

For walking along King.  So that you can walk along King, and not have to choose between a long walk between traffic and a retaining wall or a long detour into the complex.  If there is an unbroken path at complex level, people will walk along that for the visual interest and separation from traffic, but if it requires a large detour, then people are stuck with making a choice between two unfavourable options.

OK, but this really just goes back to the retaining wall question.  I don't think we should expect developers to provide alternate sidewalks, as long as their projects are good otherwise.

And really that proposed retaining wall isn't that long ...
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(04-07-2016, 01:41 PM)Elmira Guy Wrote: Not sure why you quoted my post with your comment, jordan2423. Doesn't seem to make a lot of sense, but then hey. I went to Laurier for my undergrad. What do I know?

Ya it is tough, Elmira Guy, I too went to Laurier and can't figure out how I manged to get three additional graduate degrees following an undergrad degree from such a "joke" (jordan2423) higher education institute. What do I know?

Words can make you friends or enemies, choose wisely!
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(04-07-2016, 08:55 AM)insider Wrote:
(04-07-2016, 08:31 AM)panamaniac Wrote: I suspect that the eventual development will address the retaining wall issue.  As far as I know, what we're looking at so far is one of several concepts for the eventual development.  What finally gets built may bear little or no ressemblance....

No, this was the concept chosen among a few options by Zehr Group to develop on the site. But yes, expect significant changes as this goes through the approval process... and hopefully it's not watered down to the point of mediocrity as we've seen before with other projects.

I like that this one was chosen, IF they make some revisions.  I like the 3 tower concept.  I like the overall look of it.  But I think this area is too important not to have street front retail and more street interaction.
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