Station Park | 18, 28, 36, 40, 50 fl | U/C

[Acitta]

The complaint was about the lack of visitor parking. I was suggesting an alternative. It is sad that car drivers expect the whole world to cater to them.

Car drivers are the overwhelming majority, so yes, the system (whatever it is) should cater to the majority

That is what has fucked up our cities.

[CP42]

Car drivers are the overwhelming majority, so yes, the system (whatever it is) should cater to the majority

That is what has fucked up our cities.

Urban planning that revolved around automobile transportation for years “fucked up our cities” not people who chose the most convenient mode of transportation given the city which has been planned years in advance by a local government. The majority was created by the environment around them… for example in Toronto, the majority don’t drive because the city was designed to with effective transit options. KW not so much.

[Momo26]

KW isn't going to be able to transition to a public transit first Region, likely ever tbh. The best it can hope for is providing sufficient and reliable transit to connect one part to another and seamlessly integrate all day 2 way GO transit (trains>bus) in the new future transit hub (and hopefully electrified/much agaster) and land at some happy median Mississauga-esque blend. The entire north America was designed as car centric.

[ijmorlan]

KW isn't going to be able to transition to a public transit first Region, likely ever tbh. The best it can hope for is providing sufficient and reliable transit to connect one part to another and seamlessly integrate all day 2 way GO transit (trains>bus) in the new future transit hub (and hopefully electrified/much agaster) and land at some happy median Mississauga-esque blend. The entire north America was designed as car centric.

Actually it was designed as rail centric, then re-designed as car centric.

Of course a huge amount has been built since then, so at this point a majority of people live in areas originally designed as car centric. But isn’t true of most downtowns.

[plam]

KW isn't going to be able to transition to a public transit first Region, likely ever tbh. The best it can hope for is providing sufficient and reliable transit to connect one part to another and seamlessly integrate all day 2 way GO transit (trains>bus) in the new future transit hub (and hopefully electrified/much agaster) and land at some happy median Mississauga-esque blend. The entire north America was designed as car centric.

Why not?

[Momo26]

KW isn't going to be able to transition to a public transit first Region, likely ever tbh. The best it can hope for is providing sufficient and reliable transit to connect one part to another and seamlessly integrate all day 2 way GO transit (trains>bus) in the new future transit hub (and hopefully electrified/much agaster) and land at some happy median Mississauga-esque blend. The entire north America was designed as car centric.

Why not?

B.c. we aren't on council ;/

[ac3r]

Why not?

B.c. we aren't on council ;/

Haha. It's true.

But to answer plam: because this is Waterloo Region. We don't have the money to sink into mass rapid transit projects...nor do we seem to have the political will. And whether the majority of citizens would want to see greater investment in mass transit is unknown. It's hard to sell that stuff when the majority of your population doesn't use it to begin with.

We built the LRT (with huge contributions from the federal and provincial governments) but it's a bit of a joke compared to actual rapid transit in North America. It gets you from A to B but it's not exactly fast or high capacity. It's already 2023 and the Cambridge line is still dead in the water. I doubt that'll even be started by 2033 nevermind actually operating.

We're projected to be just short of 1'000'000 people by 2040 which is a lot of people...but there is very little chance we continue to invest in mass, megaproject transit to manage that number of people. Chances are we'll find ourselves in the same situation we did prior to the LRT: what exists will become grossly overloaded (prior to the LRT, the mainlines such as the 7 & 8 as well as the iXpress routes were always packed). They then realized they needed something more because they couldn't just keep adding buses, so they invested in the LRT. The LRT has been fine for now, but by the time we are nearing a million people we're going to need much more, such as additional lines built. But I can't imagine how much of a struggle that will be when the time comes, considering how hard it was to sell the LRT to the public at the time.

The region will study and plan more LRT lines for sure and add new bike lanes, multi use trails and other auxiliary forms of transportation. But I don't see us ever becoming a transit first city/region. The car is always going to dominate, at least in our lifetimes. If only it was as easy as playing SimCity or Cities: Skylines where you can just slap down some nice trails, subway lines and LRTs and call it a day.

But anyway, wrong thread for this stuff.

[the_conestoga_guy]

B.c. we aren't on council ;/

Haha. It's true.

But to answer plam: because this is Waterloo Region. We don't have the money to sink into mass rapid transit projects...nor do we seem to have the political will. And whether the majority of citizens would want to see greater investment in mass transit is unknown. It's hard to sell that stuff when the majority of your population doesn't use it to begin with.

We built the LRT (with huge contributions from the federal and provincial governments) but it's a bit of a joke compared to actual rapid transit in North America. It gets you from A to B but it's not exactly fast or high capacity. It's already 2023 and the Cambridge line is still dead in the water. I doubt that'll even be started by 2033 nevermind actually operating.

We're projected to be just short of 1'000'000 people by 2040 which is a lot of people...but there is very little chance we continue to invest in mass, megaproject transit to manage that number of people. Chances are we'll find ourselves in the same situation we did prior to the LRT: what exists will become grossly overloaded (prior to the LRT, the mainlines such as the 7 & 8 as well as the iXpress routes were always packed). They then realized they needed something more because they couldn't just keep adding buses, so they invested in the LRT. The LRT has been fine for now, but by the time we are nearing a million people we're going to need much more, such as additional lines built. But I can't imagine how much of a struggle that will be when the time comes, considering how hard it was to sell the LRT to the public at the time.

The region will study and plan more LRT lines for sure and add new bike lanes, multi use trails and other auxiliary forms of transportation. But I don't see us ever becoming a transit first city/region. The car is always going to dominate, at least in our lifetimes. If only it was as easy as playing SimCity or Cities: Skylines where you can just slap down some nice trails, subway lines and LRTs and call it a day.

But anyway, wrong thread for this stuff.

Honestly, the Region could get, like, 90% of the way there by investing in buses and bus-priority traffic signal upgrades. It wouldn't be as flashy as a new subway, but having reliable 5-10 minute headways on every bus route in the city would do more to shift the mode-share than a single rapid transit project and it could be had for a fraction of the cost. Plus, once there's a significant mode share, it's a lot easier to advocate for bus-only lanes and the like.

[plam]

Honestly, the Region could get, like, 90% of the way there by investing in buses and bus-priority traffic signal upgrades. It wouldn't be as flashy as a new subway, but having reliable 5-10 minute headways on every bus route in the city would do more to shift the mode-share than a single rapid transit project and it could be had for a fraction of the cost. Plus, once there's a significant mode share, it's a lot easier to advocate for bus-only lanes and the like.

It was sort of a rhetorical question but also one that encouraged people to think outside their biases.

I think that it's because driving is too easy. We should absolutely have better transit. But driving, and parking in particular, needs to be harder. Pretty sure that's what the literature says about mode shift. I have personally made the decision to bike to places rather than drive, in the past, because parking was too much of a pain. That works best when the destination is enough of a draw.

[Lebronj23]

“Proposing phase 3 of the station Park Development. Building E a 50 storey mixed use tower which will contain residential, large commercial (grocer) and office uses. To be addressed 615 King West”

Well, we’ve got our first 50 storey and likely a decent height bump. This has almost certainly been redesigned as well. Would love to get some renders. Who wants to email the city?

https://www.arcgis.com/home/item.html?id...9eb177f64e

[jeffster]

“Proposing phase 3 of the station Park Development. Building E a 50 storey mixed use tower which will contain residential, large commercial (grocer) and office uses. To be addressed 615 King West”

Well, we’ve got our first 50 storey and likely a decent height bump. This has almost certainly been redesigned as well. Would love to get some renders. Who wants to email the city?

https://www.arcgis.com/home/item.html?id...9eb177f64e

50 floors is really tall. I'm trying to imagine the view, the sunset, etc at such a high level, every day if you wanted to.

[Lebronj23]

I have no idea how it works but if the developer has submitted an application with a grocery store in the plan. Does this likely mean they have at tenant already lined up and agreed upon?

[ac3r]

I have no idea how it works but if the developer has submitted an application with a grocery store in the plan. Does this likely mean they have at tenant already lined up and agreed upon?

I doubt it. Finding a tenant to agree to move into a building years before it will ever be completed and open to the public is very rare. I suspect by plan it just means building a physical space within the building that could accommodate a grocer should one choose to move in. And it is already designed in a way (physically and economically) that will greatly entice one to sign a lease. Vanmar evidently asked the architectural firm to include space in the design to include one since by the time this project is done there will be a sufficient population nearby, but I highly doubt someone like Sobey's or Fortinos has actually agreed to move in. The economics of things fluctuates way too rapidly to take that chance.

[CP42]

I would doubt anything is set in stone - but there very well could be an agreement where several conditions are in place that must be met for the agreement to hold (i.e., population growth targets, cancellation clauses, etc.). But at this point it’s purely speculation.

[tomh009]

Given that it's a condo building, that retail space would likely be a condo unit that is sold anyway; the unit owner, of course, could try to entice a grocery store to move in. I suspect that the grocery retailers are loth to invest in real estate in general.