Cycling in Waterloo Region

[bravado]

Indeed, most motorists' perception of 'narrow area at edge of road demarcated by solid white line' is 'bike lane', even though that's not necessarily true in many cases. It needs to be signposted and lane-marked as such, but motorists generally don't think to check for that.

We do need clearer and more thorough signposting of shared pathways; I don't think this one is marked as such.

When discussing future bike lanes in the redesign of Dundas Road nearby with a regional planner, he actually said that the bike icons painted onto the road are “too expensive” and they likely won’t do them for this specific project. Meanwhile, the whole lane is painted red in the Netherlands!

[danbrotherston]

Indeed, most motorists' perception of 'narrow area at edge of road demarcated by solid white line' is 'bike lane', even though that's not necessarily true in many cases. It needs to be signposted and lane-marked as such, but motorists generally don't think to check for that.

We do need clearer and more thorough signposting of shared pathways; I don't think this one is marked as such.

Yeah, I've told engineers at the region that they need to put hatch marks on edges that are not bike lanes. I've told them not doing so is professional malpractice...

They don't care...they feel that they are protected by the standards which tell them it's not necessary, and they don't care beyond that.

Honestly, Strong Towns is a revealing organization, because it shows just how entrenched modern road engineers are. I think it's going to take a legal precedent to change thing, someone, with enough money, is going to have to find the right case and sue an engineering firm. "Yes, you followed the standards, but you knew, from data, from first hand accounts, that those standards were dangerous, so you are still legally liable for the harm which resulted." Their internal ethics certainly isn't going to do it, so the legal system is going to have to be involved.

It will only take one successful lawsuit. It seems like most engineers (hell most people) these days are employed to minimize risk to establishment. As soon as a risk like that appears, they will change very quickly to minimize the risk. Whether it will be the right change, I have no idea, but it will absolutely get the ball moving in a hurry.

[danbrotherston]

Indeed, most motorists' perception of 'narrow area at edge of road demarcated by solid white line' is 'bike lane', even though that's not necessarily true in many cases. It needs to be signposted and lane-marked as such, but motorists generally don't think to check for that.

We do need clearer and more thorough signposting of shared pathways; I don't think this one is marked as such.

When discussing future bike lanes in the redesign of Dundas Road nearby with a regional planner, he actually said that the bike icons painted onto the road are “too expensive” and they likely won’t do them for this specific project. Meanwhile, the whole lane is painted red in the Netherlands!

I'll be absolutely blunt here, an engineer is just lying to you. They're not free, but as far as road construction goes, they might as well be.

Legally the road sign is what is in force, but the OTM standards also require painting bike symbols on the pavement. The region always follows these standards. If they are not painting symbols, then they are not building a bike lane, and that individual felt lying to you saying it is too expensive was an easier and simpler way to get rid of this annoying constituent than explaining the anti-cycling truth, which frankly, may expose them to questioning from council.

[Bytor]

Indeed, most motorists' perception of 'narrow area at edge of road demarcated by solid white line' is 'bike lane', even though that's not necessarily true in many cases. It needs to be signposted and lane-marked as such, but motorists generally don't think to check for that.

We do need clearer and more thorough signposting of shared pathways; I don't think this one is marked as such.

When discussing future bike lanes in the redesign of Dundas Road nearby with a regional planner, he actually said that the bike icons painted onto the road are “too expensive” and they likely won’t do them for this specific project. Meanwhile, the whole lane is painted red in the Netherlands!

I believe in the Netherlands they don't paint it red, they use red asphalt. Better durability.

[danbrotherston]

When discussing future bike lanes in the redesign of Dundas Road nearby with a regional planner, he actually said that the bike icons painted onto the road are “too expensive” and they likely won’t do them for this specific project. Meanwhile, the whole lane is painted red in the Netherlands!

I believe in the Netherlands they don't paint it red, they use red asphalt. Better durability.

The newest standard is to use red asphalt in the last lift, both for bike lanes and segregated paths. This is definitely much more expensive though, so it isn't used in all places, especially locations that are fairly far from any roadway or rural areas (except for major commuter routes), are often just in black asphalt, although it definitely varies. The main goal seems to be to limit confusion.

But there are definitely places where some municipalities have used red paint as well. It is possible this is mainly used to retrofit, but obviously I don't know the history. Also red tiles are historically very common but not preferred any longer because the surface is not smooth.

[tomh009]

In Japan I've been seeing some kind of rubberized surfaces (with some cushioning) for trails, in either red or green colour. Is that asphalt mixed with tire rubber, or something like that?

[danbrotherston]

In Japan I've been seeing some kind of rubberized surfaces (with some cushioning) for trails, in either red or green colour. Is that asphalt mixed with tire rubber, or something like that?

By the description of it, it sounds like the poured rubber and stone surfaces used in some playgrounds:

https://www.totturf.com/playground-surfa...-in-place/

I'd be surprised to see it used on a trail though, while it would provide nice cushioning, I can't imagine it's a long wearing surface, certainly I don't think it would stand up to the relatively high motor vehicle traffic on our trails (and I don't just mean plows, which could be replaced with heating).

[jamincan]

I'm a little leery of painted bike lanes and depending on the paint used, it can sometimes become very slippery when wet.

[tomh009]

In Japan I've been seeing some kind of rubberized surfaces (with some cushioning) for trails, in either red or green colour. Is that asphalt mixed with tire rubber, or something like that?

By the description of it, it sounds like the poured rubber and stone surfaces used in some playgrounds:

https://www.totturf.com/playground-surfa...-in-place/

I'd be surprised to see it used on a trail though, while it would provide nice cushioning, I can't imagine it's a long wearing surface, certainly I don't think it would stand up to the relatively high motor vehicle traffic on our trails (and I don't just mean plows, which could be replaced with heating).

Your link got me to searching for more. Some of these do claim to support light motor vehicle traffic (golf carts etc) so they should likely be OK on our bike trails as well where people have various motorized small vehicles but not cars or trucks. For example:
https://www.rubberway.com/rubber-trails

[danbrotherston]

By the description of it, it sounds like the poured rubber and stone surfaces used in some playgrounds:

https://www.totturf.com/playground-surfa...-in-place/

I'd be surprised to see it used on a trail though, while it would provide nice cushioning, I can't imagine it's a long wearing surface, certainly I don't think it would stand up to the relatively high motor vehicle traffic on our trails (and I don't just mean plows, which could be replaced with heating).

Your link got me to searching for more. Some of these do claim to support light motor vehicle traffic (golf carts etc) so they should likely be OK on our bike trails as well where people have various motorized small vehicles but not cars or trucks. For example:
https://www.rubberway.com/rubber-trails

If only our bike trails were car and truck free...

Lol...I mean, there are a number of drivers who end up on them, but the bigger problem is there is very regular service truck usage (even when I may feel that it is...unnecessary).

They'd also have to survive ploughing or heating.

But leaving that aside, it's a great idea, a forgiving surface is a big benefit for joints.

[plam]

Lol...I mean, there are a number of drivers who end up on them, but the bigger problem is there is very regular service truck usage (even when I may feel that it is...unnecessary).

They'd also have to survive ploughing or heating.

But leaving that aside, it's a great idea, a forgiving surface is a big benefit for joints.

Yeah, they were doing something this morning on the trail through Waterloo Park with trucks on the bike path...

[tomh009]

City of Kitchener trucks do use the IHT when they empty the rubbish bins in the mornings, but it's once per day and at a low speed. I don't expect that this would be a problem. (The trucks problem is more prevalent on the streets where the bike lanes are not properly separated.)

[robd]

I assume the rubber surface would just be like an athletics track. Certainly not as hard wearing as asphalt. I can't see it being great for bikes both from wear and from increased energy requirement for movement.

I spent too much time as a kid at tracks and the inside lanes were always blocked in training to avoid excessive wear, and the surface only had a longevity of around a 15 years before you could see significant wear.

[dtkvictim]

Looking for some advice.

Does anyone here have experience recording bike rides for cinematic purposes (rather than safety/legal reasons)? Think a cross of Youtube channels like Bicycle Dutch, Johnny Strides, Rambalac. I'm looking for something that is well stabilized, handlebar mounted (or discreet), and can record for ~60 minutes at a time.

GoPros seem like the default choice, but footage I've seen never seems impressive. The Hero 10 seems to have heat issues and often shuts down. The Insta360 GO 2 is almost exactly what I want (great footage, great discreet mounting system) but has a very short record time.

What cameras and mounting systems have you guys tried? Any sample footage you've taken?

Thanks.

[clasher]

I use a program for indoor training called fulgaz, they only take footage from gopro cameras and it looks fantastic. The videos get edited so they must do some kind of post-production but you might glean something filming guide about what settings to use and all that. I was thinking of renting a gopro to try out filming a ride, there's a listing on pinkbike for gopro rentals that include a k-edge out-in-front mount but they're in Toronto and I just haven't gotten around to doing it yet. Fulgaz has a facebook group that's public and you could likely find plenty of sample footage there, or on their preview page though they've been edited to some extend. If you have a facebook login I imagine you could search that group and find all kinds of stuff about people's setups.