The COVID-19 pandemic

[jeffster]

Good grief Dan, that is ignorant as hell. There are plenty more things more dangerous to children than covid-19, and I don't see anyone here saying anything about it. But clearly YOU'RE willing to risk a child's health with a vaccine that might be more risky than the disease itself. Only reason why they even vaccinated youngsters is to protect old people like you, not the other way round.

It sounds like you’ve read about this. Can you share with us information which suggests that there is a possibility the vaccine could be more dangerous than Covid to children? My understanding up to this point is that this is about as likely as blowing up the kitchen with wrong proportions in a cake recipe; scientists who work on vaccines actually do know something about immunology.

The reason to vaccinate as many people as possible is to end the pandemic. This means reducing transmissions everywhere, including among those who don’t suffer from it themselves. This is the same reason that smart jurisdictions are promoting the HPV vaccine for children of both sexes, not just the girls who can actually get cervical cancer.

Sure, I have been doing a lot of reading on this. Again, this is one reason why those under 12 aren’t vaccinated. Further to that, it’s a reason why Moderna was shelved for those under 18 (despite PHAC and PHU’s saying Moderna and Pfizer are identical).

Here is one more recent study (September 8): https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/...21262866v1

Main talking points:

Results A total of 257 CAEs were identified. Rates per million following dose 2 among males were 162.2 (ages 12-15) and 94.0 (ages 16-17); among females, rates were 13.0 and 13.4 per million, respectively. For boys 12-15 without medical comorbidities receiving their second mRNA vaccination dose, the rate of CAE is 3.7 to 6.1 times higher than their 120-day COVID-19 hospitalization risk as of August 21, 2021 (7-day hospitalizations 1.5/100k population) and 2.6-4.3-fold higher at times of high weekly hospitalization risk (7-day hospitalizations 2.1/100k), such as during January 2021. For boys 16-17 without medical comorbidities, the rate of CAE is currently 2.1 to 3.5 times higher than their 120-day COVID-19 hospitalization risk, and 1.5 to 2.5 times higher at times of high weekly COVID-19 hospitalization.

Conclusions Post-vaccination CAE rate was highest in young boys aged 12-15 following dose two. For boys 12-17 without medical comorbidities, the likelihood of post vaccination dose two CAE is 162.2 and 94.0/million respectively. This incidence exceeds their expected 120-day COVID-19 hospitalization rate at both moderate (August 21, 2021 rates) and high COVID-19 hospitalization incidence. Further research into the severity and long-term sequelae of post-vaccination CAE is warranted. Quantification of the benefits of the second vaccination dose and vaccination in addition to natural immunity in this demographic may be indicated to minimize harm.

My opinion is, and likely always will be this: don’t vaccinate those that are of very low risk of hospitalization from Covid-19. If the study above is correct, than the risk in certain age groups of hospitalization is significantly higher for vaccinated youngsters versus the same group unvaccinated.

Risks starts to even out around 20 or so, and than falls quickly as you get older. That’s not to say the vaccine isn’t risky (though in many cases, it is less risky in older groups than younger, for some reason).

Besides all that, I got my AZ (1 shot) when it was still safe. Then it was considered risky, so I had to get the Moderna shot. J&J isn’t even being used. We personally had a family contact die after receiving Moderna, though an older male.

With our government and PHU’s and PHAC recommending this, than that, and changing to that and this, as a parent, I sure the hell wouldn’t risk my child’s life on some vaccine they don’t need.

Now, to your point, the reason to vaccinate as many people is to end the pandemic is fair game. But that was not what we were told at the beginning. We were told 70%, then 80%, of those eligible, (it was 18 and up, then 12 and up) to end the pandemic, but we have reached those numbers and here we still are.

But to say we vaccinate children to protect them, as some are suggesting, is disingenuous. The vaccine is of higher risk to children than the disease. That’s the issue. Maybe that changes if we have another variant that affects the young.

Either way, back to my original point: if this virus was as destructive to those over 18 as it is to those under 18, and if the vaccine was as risky to those over 18 as it is to those under 18, the vaccine wouldn’t be used. In fact, there would have never been a vaccine, and this covid-19 would never had made the news.

I don’t think it’s too much to ask for the children being left out.