Kitchener, Waterloo, Cambridge and Brantford most vulnerable to tariffs

[danbrotherston]

:facepalm:



It's 2024...if you're denying climate change...you have zero credibility, because climate change denial is reality denial. You might as well be a flat earther.



This is one of the nicest things about living in Europe...there is no serious climate change here (at least western Europe).

Edit: This is one of the nicest things about living in Europe...there is no serious climate change denial here (at least western Europe).

[Acitta]

:facepalm:

It's 2024...if you're denying climate change...you have zero credibility, because climate change denial is reality denial. You might as well be a flat earther.

This is one of the nicest things about living in Europe...there is no serious climate change here (at least western Europe).

Scientists are saying that global warming will collapse of the AMOC in the near future, which will cause Europe to become colder. Europe is much warmer than the same latitudes in North America because of the AMOC.

[danbrotherston]

:facepalm:

It's 2024...if you're denying climate change...you have zero credibility, because climate change denial is reality denial. You might as well be a flat earther.

This is one of the nicest things about living in Europe...there is no serious climate change here (at least western Europe).

Scientists are saying that global warming will collapse of the AMOC in the near future, which will cause Europe to become colder. Europe is much warmer than the same latitudes in North America because of the AMOC.

Yes, sorry, I rewrote my comment a few times because...frankly...I try hard to be at least somewhat polite and civil, but climate change denial is absolutely insane.

I didn't mean to say there was no serious "climate change" here there absolutely is. More so even than Canada...people here routinely tell me how they used to go skating in the winter. I have pictures of people skating in the canal in front of my house--which is only 18 years old--and nobody expects to ever do that again....except if, or when, the AMOC does collapse.

And I live in a country where the mean height above sea level is only a couple meters. The Netherlands is especially vulnerable to climate change.

What I meant to say (and did in previous revisions of the comment) was that there is no serious climate change denial here. Even the most ardent opposition to climate change mitigation are merely discussing the degree. Not a company, not person, has seriously parroted any of the climate change DENIAL talking points that the oil and gas industry have spent so many billions promoting in North America here.

The very same talking points that were parroted so passionately by the previous commentor here.

[plam]

Um, with no fossil fuels, how do you suggest we make all the day to day products we utilize that are made from oil product derivatives, Like plastic.  Here is the other thing, for every kilowatt of electricity you generate from renewable sources, (solar, wind) you need to build instant on power generating for redundancy. Most instant on is natural gas production.  Now, just say we can generate enough electricity to power all your EV's, heavy machinery (which wont work) home heating and cooling etc... How do you plan to distribute it ?  Do you have any idea of the infrastructure required to create a network of distribution?  Every single neighborhood would have to have all distribution replaced with bigger transformers and heavier conductors... We are so far away from getting away from fossil fuels....

We also need to use less plastic, but I want to talk about using less fossil fuels for daily needs. EVs aren't great and we should be using more ebikes and LRTs and fewer cars anyway. There is no reason that consumer preference should be so much for SUVs.

Home heating and cooling, for instance, can definitely be done by heat pumps much more efficiently than with gas. Apparently "energy communities" can help reduce the cost of distribution.

And no one said climate change is a joke.  Many experts say we are still exiting the ice age.  The climate has been changing forever and will continue to.

It's clear that the CO2 levels in the atmosphere are at the highest levels that they've ever been in human history, and that sea levels were 8m higher than they are today last time they were at this level.

[bravado]

Um, with no fossil fuels, how do you suggest we make all the day to day products we utilize that are made from oil product derivatives, Like plastic.  Here is the other thing, for every kilowatt of electricity you generate from renewable sources, (solar, wind) you need to build instant on power generating for redundancy. Most instant on is natural gas production.  Now, just say we can generate enough electricity to power all your EV's, heavy machinery (which wont work) home heating and cooling etc... How do you plan to distribute it ?  Do you have any idea of the infrastructure required to create a network of distribution?  Every single neighborhood would have to have all distribution replaced with bigger transformers and heavier conductors... We are so far away from getting away from fossil fuels.... And no one said climate change is a joke.  Many experts say we are still exiting the ice age.  The climate has been changing forever and will continue to.

Less fossil fuels over time, not "no" fossil fuels. An important distinction that you are missing on purpose.

[ijmorlan]

:facepalm:

It's 2024...if you're denying climate change...you have zero credibility, because climate change denial is reality denial. You might as well be a flat earther.

This is one of the nicest things about living in Europe...there is no serious climate change here (at least western Europe).

Scientists are saying that global warming will collapse of the AMOC in the near future, which will cause Europe to become colder. Europe is much warmer than the same latitudes in North America because of the AMOC.

Which idiots will then use as proof that global warming isn’t real.

:facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm:

[tomh009]

Scientists are saying that global warming will collapse of the AMOC in the near future, which will cause Europe to become colder. Europe is much warmer than the same latitudes in North America because of the AMOC.

Which idiots will then use as proof that global warming isn’t real.

:facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm:

If/when AMOC (aka the Gulf Current) collapses, it will also get substantially warmer in eastern North America, as we will no longer get the cold current coming across the North Atlantic.

[Momo26]

Why do proponents of global warming/climate change have to resort to name calling?

Is your argument so weak that your brain has to revert to adolescent levels and start pointing fingers?

And btw, there are always more sides to the story and more than meets the eye. With the correct amount of media attention, constant bombardment of fear-based propaganda, masses can be convinced of *anything*.

This is from an accredited source, not some fly-by-night armchair scientist blog:

https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC1112950/


https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC1112950/

[Rainrider22]

Why do proponents of global warming/climate change have to resort to name calling?

Is your argument so weak that your brain has to revert to adolescent levels and start pointing fingers?

And btw, there are always more sides to the story and more than meets the eye. With the correct amount of media attention, constant bombardment of fear-based propaganda, masses can be convinced of *anything*.

This is from an accredited source, not some fly-by-night armchair scientist blog:

https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC1112950/


https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC1112950/

Good morning,   thank you for your comments.  I have been on this site from the early stages. I pay the yearly fees to help support it but I must say, I am starting to reflect whether it is worth it anymore.   The difficulty on this site is that it does not promote discussion unless you are of the same view point as a select few on here.  If you notice, it is always the same few people posting discussion points.  The same few people typically share the same ideals.  I have spoken to a number of people over the years who have told me they just won't enter into discussions here because of precisely what Momo26 just stated. 

People on this site need to start working on fostering a place where everyone feels comfortable to add their "opinion" . Very few on here are experts on the many related topics so for the most part, it is opinion.  So please allow others to add their own personal  opinions in an environment free of constant attacks and criticism.

Let's encourage more people to get involved and offer there insite through their lens.  Maybe we can actually learn from others instead of the same thought constantly....

[danbrotherston]

Why do proponents of global warming/climate change have to resort to name calling?

Is your argument so weak that your brain has to revert to adolescent levels and start pointing fingers?

And btw, there are always more sides to the story and more than meets the eye. With the correct amount of media attention, constant bombardment of fear-based propaganda, masses can be convinced of *anything*.

This is from an accredited source, not some fly-by-night armchair scientist blog:

https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC1112950/


https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC1112950/

You just cited an article that is almost 30 years old.

Did you know that? Do you think that we've done no research in the last 30 years? Do you think that the evidence of climate change hasn't become significantly more clear in the past 30 years?

And yes, the denial of climate change is proof positive that those with money can spend it to convince people of anything.

And no, people aren't name calling because the argument is weak, they are name calling because that's the only thing to do with a flat earther...because there isn't an argument to be had...because you are denying reality. There is no argument that we can have with you, no discussion, you aren't having a fact base rational discussion, because you cannot have such a discussion about things which are plainly and clearly known at this point.

You can pretend to do so, but then you do foolish things like post a near-30 year old article and claim that it gives your side credibility.

[danbrotherston]

Why do proponents of global warming/climate change have to resort to name calling?

Is your argument so weak that your brain has to revert to adolescent levels and start pointing fingers?

And btw, there are always more sides to the story and more than meets the eye. With the correct amount of media attention, constant bombardment of fear-based propaganda, masses can be convinced of *anything*.

This is from an accredited source, not some fly-by-night armchair scientist blog:

https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC1112950/


https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC1112950/

Good morning,   thank you for your comments.  I have been on this site from the early stages. I pay the yearly fees to help support it but I must say, I am starting to reflect whether it is worth it anymore.   The difficulty on this site is that it does not promote discussion unless you are of the same view point as a select few on here.  If you notice, it is always the same few people posting discussion points.  The same few people typically share the same ideals.  I have spoken to a number of people over the years who have told me they just won't enter into discussions here because of precisely what Momo26 just stated. 

People on this site need to start working on fostering a place where everyone feels comfortable to add their "opinion" . Very few on here are experts on the many related topics so for the most part, it is opinion.  So please allow others to add their own personal  opinions in an environment free of constant attacks and criticism.

Let's encourage more people to get involved and offer there insite through their lens.  Maybe we can actually learn from others instead of the same thought constantly....

Some things are not "opinions"...from climate change denial, to calling homeless people vermin...these are not things we should tolerate. If you want to bring ignorance and hate into a discussion, you shouldn't be pandered to. If you don't like that...too bad. Because on the flip side, if we entertain that type of discussion, that too will exclude people. It's the paradox of tolerance.

[Rainrider22]

Thanks for missing the point...Sometimes you need to pause

[Momo26]

These kind of discussions are utterly useless.

These ideas are 100% designed to be extremely polarizing.

[tomh009]

This is from an accredited source, not some fly-by-night armchair scientist blog:

https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC1112950/

BMJ is indeed a respected medical news source, though not a research journal. The particular item you linked to is essentially a letter to the editor, though, from a GP (family doctor) in the UK, not a scientist.

The current scientific consensus strongly agrees that human activity is causing the climate change. The Wikipedia article has plenty of links to references:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scientific...ate_change

Of course everyone can choose to believe in whatever they want, but it really doesn't change the reality that we're careening towards a major global crisis as the temperatures and sea levels rise.

[creative]

Thanks for posting Rainrider22. This is so true and one particular reply to your post just further amplifies this completely. I took a mental break from this site for almost a year after having also been here from the beginning. I have talked with people who used to be on this site and they indicated that they all left because of things that you listed. They also left primarily due to one particular individual and their supposed expert knowledge on just about every topic discussed on here.