King-Victoria Transit Hub

[Smore]

Back to the King and Victoria Transit Hub....

http://mhbpna.blogspot.ca/2016/01/grandl...rther.html

" GrandLinq and Region plan to further restrict access to Waterloo Street

As we all know, Waterloo Street, between Breithaupt Street and Victoria, has been closed for some time and will never reopen.  This is because of the future Transit Hub.

Regional report P-14-061 of May 27, 2014, identifies this portion of Waterloo Street as a “main entrance from the Breithaupt Block and the residential area north of the Transit Hub” that will “form a strong pedestrian connection through the Hub site”.


The City of Kitchener handed over this part of Waterloo Street to the Region in the name of progress and the future of transit and added the caveat that it be “used primarily for pedestrian or vehicular movement”. While everyone hopes for the best, and we believe in the rosy future of transit, the Region and GrandLinq do not always have our neighbourhood interests at heart. In fact, it is mainly through the diligent research of local resident Bryan Smith that we even know some of their plans.

Since the Region is cutting off one of our streets, which was a convenient access to downtown Kitchener, we expected them to uphold their promise to make it a “strong pedestrian connection”.  Yet a couple of years ago (at one of the final public meetings) planners indicated they were considering putting in stairs and an elevator. When we objected and said cyclists would want a clear path with no stairs, they claimed that would be too expensive because of the infrastructure that needed to be moved. We are still trying to monitor this issue.

We in the neighbourhood have tried to follow the Transit Hub plans but his has been difficult because things are very quiet now while the LRT construction takes over as the biggest concern in our area.

However, an LRT issue has unexpectedly become very important to the Waterloo Street “corridor”.  There will be a transit station at the corner of Victoria and King and all stations need a “Traction Power Sub-Station” (TPSS).  Originally this structure was going to be located behind the School of Pharmacy where it would not interfere with pedestrians or traffic. "




Thoughts on this?  Seems like trivial details like contamination hasn't changed many other ION layouts....

[KevinL]

I don't recall anything in the Waterloo Street plans ever promising no-step access for cyclists. It's an ideal, certainly, but the geometry of the site and the required infrastructure would take precedence.

Hopefully something like a smooth angled surface alongside the steps, to roll one's bike while walking on the stairs, will help for thse using the passageway.

[MidTowner]

You're right, KevinL, no-step access would be preferable, but a bike trough addresses the issue if it's really not possible.

I think they're concern about the substation is very valid, given the size. Is that a done deal? I'm sure it could be made to look attractive, but its consumption of half of the road width will limit options to make this access great.

[clasher]

I've long preferred crossing Victoria at Duke Street; it already has a light and easily connects to the rest of downtown. The only time I used to use Waterloo ave was late at night when there wasn't a lot of traffic on Victoria and it was easy to make the left-turn lane on Victoria. I do think the TPSS should be put at its original location and the contamination should be cleaned up, even if it costs money. One way or another "the taxpayer" will end up paying for its removal.

[notmyfriends]

This substation was discussed from post 1812 in the ion thread. It does seems like a very unfortunate placement.

[KevinL]

Was that determined to be the final substation position? If it recall there was confusion about it being too far from the LRT lines.

[chutten]

My prediction is that Waterloo St will be of lesser importance once King reopens. Then the traffic can split to Duke and King depending on their destination on the other side of the tracks.

[DKsan]

I thought the plan for Waterloo Street was for it to become pedestrian-cyclist access only when the Intermodal hub opens?

If that's the case, meh on that substation.

[MidTowner]

DKsan is correct that foot and bicycle through traffic will be allowed through, and that there will be a Waterloo Street access for those same users. The substation is half the width of the right-of-way, so this access, which was in the past framed as very important by the Region, could easily be compromised by it.

[Canard]

But if it's only taking up half the road width then there is still one full road lane width for cycles and pedestrians. Akin to a one-lane one-way road, which I think is certainly wide enough. Much wider than the Iron Horse Trail, for example.

[Viewfromthe42]

It'll be interesting to see how it's done. If you walk around the Kaufman Lofts parking lot, there are multiple high-fenced areas closed off for things like waste. Granted, they don't make sounds (when I'm around), but they don't bother me excessively. That said, for something as grandiose as this intermodal station, I would have higher expectations of pedestrian experiences than my building's parking lot.

[MidTowner]

I think the devil will be in the details, too. I don't think it's a priori a failure because it's half the width, but it doesn't seem in keeping with a dramatic entrance to an iconic civic building, or a link between two neighbourhoods. But I do think, if pains are taken to hide the substation in an aesthetically pleasing way, it could work.

[clasher]

Looking at the concept renderings on the first page of this thread they don't seem to show much of Waterloo Ave. being a pass-through. If there is access from the Victoria side I would assume it's more for buses to get in and out of the bus terminal part of the building rather than allowing for cyclists and pedestrians to cross through the building. Even if pedestrians and cyclists were able to walk through they'd still have to walk/ride down to either Duke or King to cross safely so it does seem to me to be a bit of rabble rousing without much in the way of actual facts to go on.

Also, this drawing:


They are gonna need the best truck drivers around to get the 53' trailer in and out of that loading dock unless it's supposed to be accessed from the Victoria side...

[MidTowner]

You're right that the terminal will be accessible from Victoria via Waterloo Street (but not from Breithaupt). But that doesn't preclude a through-connection for people on foot and bicycle.

[Pheidippides]

The "pick-up/drop-off" ramp to the upper level accessed off of Duke is a different concept.

Covered train shed is nice, but I like the more bulbous one that was floated as a concept a few years ago.

Interesting that a major incorrect detail that the project is for the Region of Waterloo and not the City of Kitchener made it through to publication.

Where is the image featuring the old TTC subway cars headed to Downsview supposed to be?