King-Victoria Transit Hub

[mpd618]

Except for the fact that people cannot be discouraged into taking a non-existent alternative. But, yeah, aside from that his proposal makes perfect sense.

This is a thread about the King & Victoria terminal, and I believe the parking derail stemmed from discussion of redevelopment of the Charles Street terminal site. So if we're talking about discouraging people from driving, we're talking about it in the context of downtown Kitchener. For a large number of people in Waterloo Region, transit to downtown Kitchener is not a "non-existent alternative".

[Canard]

If this thread is about the terminal - what's the status of it? How many years will we realistically have a skeleton LRT station with a pile of dirt where the Beer Store was? Why isn't this advancing faster? It's going to look really lame getting beefed up GO service only to dump people half a kilometre away from light rail.

[Pheidippides]

If this thread is about the terminal - what's the status of it?  How many years will we realistically have a skeleton LRT station with a pile of dirt where the Beer Store was?  Why isn't this advancing faster?  It's going to look really lame getting beefed up GO service only to dump people half a kilometre away from light rail.

From the 2015-2019 budget forecast (page 58) it shows $404,000 expenditure on the hub in 2015 and nothing beyond likely because the project will be largely handed off after this year:

In short, RFQ fall 2015, RFQ short list late 2015/early 2016, RFP proposals first half 2016, RFP selection & closure late 2016, construction begins 2017.

A Regional report  (page 167) with rough timelines was produced in May 2014.

The Kitchener Post also had some rough timelines in an article last May.

I'm curious how they will design and implement the railway overpass over King when they don't fully know what will be built on top (train shed or not, etc.).

[white_brian]

I was kinda hoping we would have some finalized drawings by now....

[numberguy]

But yeah, you're right if I were nice about it and just posted nicer sounding messages on a bbs people would magically love cyclists and pedestrians and we would all get along. If you don't like my posts you can just rate them a zero and move on. I don't give a fuck if anyone on this board likes me.

Anyway,

I imagine when they build the LRT/transit hub they'll design the building so that it's essential a tower podium with sufficient columns and sewer connections so they can put more storeys on top later. Does anyone know if they plan on mixed use for any future tower builds?

It would vary with the winning proposal.   The various consortiums would put up their designs for evaluation and selection.

WRT to cars versus bikes, I don't think anyone was trying to tell you want to do or like.   I think Canard was just saying if we want agreements to be reached, meaningful dialogue has to occur between parties.  Simply put, in Waterloo Region, car commuters would pretty handily outvote bike commuters.   So it's fine to do your own thing, but 95% of the voters are simply going to not care.  It's not a question of liking you or not, it's more of a question do you want things to change for the better or do you want to continue on?  

[nms]

I expect that there are other negotiations going on behind the scenes before we hear anything concrete. For instance:
- should there be two tracks and two platforms (or at least the possibility to add a second platform). I'm suspicious, especially given GO's long-term intent to build a terminal further west, that there may be movement towards pushing GO service further west
- will VIA want to move (likely), and if so, what infrastructure will they need?
- who owns the current station?
- Beyond the basics of station platform clearances, whose station standards are used for the rest of the infrastructure (GO, VIA, Region, City)? This could dictate everything from bus bays, to toilets, to parking capacity

Planting a station isn't quite as easy a popping a new station down in your favourite town planning game (though I've planted my fair share of those too).

[Pheidippides]

One more small step, Waterloo St to be closed permanently June 26th at 12:01AM.
http://www.regionofwaterloo.ca/en/region...f#page=256
"Grandlinq has indicated it is now necessary to permanently close Regional Road 40 (Waterloo Street) to vehicle through traffic for the construction of the King Street grade separation."

[Spokes]

Why does it need to be closed for the grade separation? It obviously has to be closed for the transit hub, but why now?

[panamaniac]

Why does it need to be closed for the grade separation?  It obviously has to be closed for the transit hub, but why now?

I was wondering the same thing, especially since I like to deke onto Waterloo St rather than proceeding to Duke, when traffic on Victoria permits. 

[Viewfromthe42]

There was word that getting the rail high enough that LRT and cars could pass below it while still rising to meet Victoria would require some grading of the tracks, and if the tracks need to be raised at all, Waterloo is a likely spot for it to happen. It could also be some part of the overall construction safety/staging needs, even given all of King and the Intermodal Hub areas available.

[taylortbb]

The mainline is being raised several feet to create the clearance underneath. This won't be like the Weber underpass where the rail line was left in place and the road lowered, as that creates a road grade that's too steep for the LRT. Raising it also makes the intermodal station design better, as the pedestrian access can go underneath the rail lines to the different platforms.

The grading of the tracks means they have to be raised past Waterloo street, as you don't want the intermodal platform to be at a significant grade. My understanding the grading work will go all the way from Park to Weber.

[panamaniac]

That explains it. Thanks.

[DHLawrence]

What is the schedule for raising the line? Will they be able to do it without disrupting VIA service?

[taylortbb]

What is the schedule for raising the line? Will they be able to do it without disrupting VIA service?

It's starting now, that's why they've closed King from Victoria to Wellington and now Waterloo St. It will be closed for 18 months for construction. Because it's CN's north mainline it will be done without disrupting service. I believe the plan is to construct a temporary track at the current grade, and then a new track at the new grade, then they can do a weekend switchover from temporary track to new track.

[DHLawrence]

Couldn't think of a better place to post this; mods feel free to move to a separate thread.

They call it a new service, but as the commuter they interviewed said we're just getting back the train VIA cancelled a few years ago.

Via Rail announces plans for another train from Guelph to Toronto in 2016

Via Rail plans to add one train in the morning from Guelph to Toronto and one train returning in the evening, sometime in 2016.

The company's president, Yves Desjardins-Siciliano, announced the news Tuesday to a group of rail advocates in Stratford.

"We plan the new trains at 6:30 from Stratford and 16:30 from Toronto hopefully by 2016," Via Rail spokesperson Maxime Dupont-Demers confirmed in an email.

"Before offering this new service, we need to address details and operating schedule with the infrastructure owners. Once this is completed, we will be able to finalize our network planning and set a start date."

Dupont-Demers added the trains will also run through Kitchener-Waterloo.