TEK Tower (30 Francis) | 45 fl | U/C

[Joedelay Highhoe]

Even these little 500 square foot shoe box style condos go for $400k+ nowadays. The target market is investors.

[tomh009]

Even these little 500 square foot shoe box style condos go for $400k+ nowadays. The target market is investors.

That's a lot of investors needed for this one.

Especially when there is a lot more new downtown rental housing coming online now, far more than we have had in decades.

[Joedelay Highhoe]

Who needs renters when real estate grows 20% year over year?

[ac3r]

Investors are often what result in tiny units. But it's also investors that allow buildings like these to get rapidly proposed, approved and constructed. They pour money in once the sales open up which lets the developer move ahead with things a lot faster.

[dtkvictim]

Is it just me, or are condos getting smaller in size with each new development?!

These are incredibly small but I'm also surprised that there seem to be no larger units contemplated. Even if young techies are the target market, surely there are a few folks out there that can afford more space.

I see this narrative a lot, that demand for buildings like this one are coming from young tech employees. But working in the tech industry, I haven't really seen any evidence of this. I actually don't think I've had a single co-worker (in KW) that lived in a high-rise. Let alone a tiny ~500sqft one.

Investors are often what result in tiny units. But it's also investors that allow buildings like these to get rapidly proposed, approved and constructed. They pour money in once the sales open up which lets the developer move ahead with things a lot faster.

And is that a good thing? I get that this forum is excited to see tall buildings popping up at a rapid pace, but I think the nature of the demand is important. Would it not be more desirable to have a less transient, owner-occupied community? If the demand is only there from investors, is it not just speculation?

[tomh009]

I see this narrative a lot, that demand for buildings like this one are coming from young tech employees. But working in the tech industry, I haven't really seen any evidence of this. I actually don't think I've had a single co-worker (in KW) that lived in a high-rise. Let alone a tiny ~500sqft one.

This is just an anecdote, not data, but on our software development team (about 20 people), we have four people living in condo buildings -- and three of them are renting. I have no idea what their unit sizes are, though.

[ktmbtsmrt]

I presume the podium is completely parking garage then?

Not entirely. It'll have the usual stuff like a concierge, mail room, service rooms and resident amenities etc. Floors 2-6 will be parking as well as some residential units. Floor 7 will have a few more residential units as well as the rooftop terrace by the local GSP Group Incorporated which is proposed to have some standard facilities like seating, plants/trees, a grill. They are doing most of the landscape architecture for the building...which is not a whole lot besides some trees and the terrace.

I imagine the lack of retail is due to the location. It's not really on a block that gets much foot traffic.

There should be retail - even if it is an 'urban' box store location like a Staples or something. There is no foot traffic because there is mostly parking in that area. If a 44 fl building goes in, I'm sure there can be justification for some kind of retail, or even an 'urban Sobeys'. We gotta think about the future of that area, and it would be a shame if every new building made a choice like that.

By the way, in case this reads as directed at you I don't mean it as such. But if I was the city, a developer for a project this large didn't try to have some kind of 'meaningful' retail added, I would try to facilitate some kind of agreement with retailers - large or small for this location.

[tomh009]

By the way, in case this reads as directed at you I don't mean it as such. But if I was the city, a developer for a project this large didn't try to have some kind of 'meaningful' retail added, I would try to facilitate some kind of agreement with retailers - large or small for this location.

That's a good concept, but difficult to do pre-construction as most retailers would not want to wait four-five years for the space to be ready, unless it were something very special. After construction start, it would indeed be good. Maybe something the BIA should be involved in!

[nms]

What tools does the City have to encourage larger units? (ie 750+ sq feet, or even *gasp* a two or three bedroom, non-penthouse suite that would appeal to a family with children?)

[tomh009]

What tools does the City have to encourage larger units? (ie 750+ sq feet, or even *gasp* a two or three bedroom, non-penthouse suite that would appeal to a family with children?)

Really, only bonusing. Or accepting variances in exchange for larger units -- but generally there will be (arguably) more important things in the variance negotiations, such as affordable units.

[jeffster]

The height of 134.5 meters includes the mechanical penthouse.

Yet, when you look at the 44 floors plus mechanical, from ground to roof of mechanical it's 144.4 meters or about 474 feet.

[creative]

What tools does the City have to encourage larger units? (ie 750+ sq feet, or even *gasp* a two or three bedroom, non-penthouse suite that would appeal to a family with children?)

With new construction pushing $900 square foot, how much demand is there for $700,000 - $1,000,000+ 2 or 3 bedroom condos?

[tomh009]

What tools does the City have to encourage larger units? (ie 750+ sq feet, or even *gasp* a two or three bedroom, non-penthouse suite that would appeal to a family with children?)

With new construction pushing $900 square foot, how much demand is there for $700,000 - $1,000,000+ 2 or 3 bedroom condos?

$700K would still be 20% cheaper than the average house in K-W. So, I really don't think the sticker shock would be there.

[cherrypark]

What tools does the City have to encourage larger units? (ie 750+ sq feet, or even *gasp* a two or three bedroom, non-penthouse suite that would appeal to a family with children?)

With new construction pushing $900 square foot, how much demand is there for $700,000 - $1,000,000+ 2 or 3 bedroom condos?

$700k at 20% down is in the ballpark of $2500 monthly. Considering the current cost of renting for a new 2-bed I don't think its too far out of line, and with the type of buyer moving to town, as high as those costs are.

[jeffster]

With new construction pushing $900 square foot, how much demand is there for $700,000 - $1,000,000+ 2 or 3 bedroom condos?

$700K would still be 20% cheaper than the average house in K-W. So, I really don't think the sticker shock would be there.

Factor in condo fees. Factor in that those needing 3 bedrooms probably want some property (for their kids). It's a different clientele entirely that buys these condos vs a townhome/semi/house.