Grand River Transit

[ac3r]

When you gottta go, I guess...

There should be more public toilets! There are in other countries (Japan, NZ, China). I was getting off the flixbus the other day and wishing there were some in downtown Kitchener...

I don't want my tax dollars being wasted on this! There are 19 LRT station platforms you can piss on when you've gotta go. If that's not enough, go find a bus stop. Keep up dude, it's a free for all now. :^)

[KevinL]

The possible loss of Route 2 has reached some community transit advocates, who have put a petition up.

[jeffster]

The possible loss of Route 2 has reached some community transit advocates, who have put a petition up.

I signed and donated to this petition. This is a boneheaded move - and being seconded by folks that have zero interest in Kitchener is beyond weird. Shit like that makes me feel we're better off as a single city. Back in the day, when Kitchener Transit was run in K-W only, it was a better service. GRT is junk. But cancelling a route like #2 makes me feel we should cancel other less used route. Like skip the routes to the townships.

Anyway, that's the end of my rant.

I should add, #2 was affected for years by construction on Stirling, as well as it was reduced when the Ion was approved in as a cost saving. At the very end of Stirling is a smaller apartment building, I want to say maybe 30 units. However, many of those folks were using the transit, and many were disabled. About 2/3rd's the residents moved out after the transit was taken away, and in the end, the owner never bothered to re-rent those united out, and renovated the entire apartment to something much more expensive.

Really great planning by the region in this regard. Sadly we have a bonehead at our regional chair now, a mayor that doesn't care (except for food, he cares about food), so things will only get worse.

[dunkalunk]

Two months after GRT proposed cutting Route 2, they have a feedback form up on their website. https://www.grt.ca/en/about-grt/plans-an...djustments

I'm suggesting they terminate Route 2 at Sunrise Centre in the West and Mill/Borden Station in the East order to keep the most useful portion of the route while also cutting the number of buses it takes to serve the area in half. The Eastern part of Route 2 is mirrored by Route 205 on Ottawa St and the Western part is very suburban and mostly served by Route 1 with direct connections with both Downtown and The Boardwalk with 15 minute peak and Sunday service.

[SF22]

Two months after GRT proposed cutting Route 2, they have a feedback form up on their website. https://www.grt.ca/en/about-grt/plans-an...djustments

I'm suggesting they terminate Route 2 at Sunrise Centre in the West and Mill/Borden Station in the East order to keep the most useful portion of the route while also cutting the number of buses it takes to serve the area in half. The Eastern part of Route 2 is mirrored by Route 205 on Ottawa St and the Western part is very suburban and mostly served by Route 1 with direct connections with both Downtown and The Boardwalk with 15 minute peak and Sunday service.

Thanks for the heads-up about this. I've submitted a comment suggesting that they end the route at the Aud on the east end (ideally with a stop right on East/Eugene George Way - how do we not have better transit to our main events building?) and at the Fischer-Hallman/Highland plaza on the west end (which would still provide a connection to those in Forest Heights who use route 1 to leave their neighbourhood). It trims up the route by maybe 30-40%, and doesn't leave any massive holes in connectivity.

[dunkalunk]

I was looking at some historic maps and it turns out Route 2 used to go downtown. Just thinking how useful that would be from a connectivity standpoint compared to needing to connect with ION or another route to get downtown. No wonder ridership didn't recover.

https://imgur.com/gallery/YDvUDaT

[tomh009]

I was looking at some historic maps and it turns out Route 2 used to go downtown. Just thinking how useful that would be from a connectivity standpoint compared to needing to connect with ION or another route to get downtown. No wonder ridership didn't recover.

Yes, in the past all routes went to downtown Kitchener. The new model is using the ION as the spine, so the routes don't need to go to DTK to connect. Pros and cons to every model, of course.

[dunkalunk]

There's nothing notable at King and Borden, except the Tim Hortons, a self-storage, and Grand River Rocks, not the type of land uses that would be friendly to people walking. Given the choice, I'd think folks on Route 2 would rather go downtown without needing to transfer. I think the main reason it continues along Ottawa is that the bus needs somewhere for the bus to park and for drivers to take a break. If this could be moved somewhere else, (say Sunrise Centre) then the route could be more useful.

[SF22]

There's nothing notable at King and Borden, except the Tim Hortons, a self-storage, and Grand River Rocks, not the type of land uses that would be friendly to people walking. Given the choice, I'd think folks on Route 2 would rather go downtown without needing to transfer. I think the main reason it continues along Ottawa is that the bus needs somewhere for the bus to park and for drivers to take a break. If this could be moved somewhere else, (say Sunrise Centre) then the route could be more useful.

There's definitely not much there right now, but there's at least 3 properties with plans to develop within a block or two of Borden Station. It feels a little silly to remove a bus line that's bound to get a serious influx of users in a few years; I'd be concerned that they wouldn't replace it when the demand shows up.

[ijmorlan]

There's nothing notable at King and Borden, except the Tim Hortons, a self-storage, and Grand River Rocks, not the type of land uses that would be friendly to people walking. Given the choice, I'd think folks on Route 2 would rather go downtown without needing to transfer. I think the main reason it continues along Ottawa is that the bus needs somewhere for the bus to park and for drivers to take a break. If this could be moved somewhere else, (say Sunrise Centre) then the route could be more useful.

There's definitely not much there right now, but there's at least 3 properties with plans to develop within a block or two of Borden Station. It feels a little silly to remove a bus line that's bound to get a serious influx of users in a few years; I'd be concerned that they wouldn't replace it when the demand shows up.

That’s the genius of it: the demand can’t show up if the route isn’t there! If they kept the route, it would get overcrowded and they’d pretty much have to increase it.

[Acitta]

GRT decision to cut Route 2 leaves parts of Kitchener without access to transit

Community members are upset Grand River Transit is cancelling an underused bus route in Kitchener, Ont. People who live along Route 2 say it's a lifeline to get to school, work, shopping and medical appointments.

[danbrotherston]

You know, sometimes we have to make hard choices, so I understand where GRT is coming from.

But it seems that certain things are insulated from hard choices...policing, roads...when was the last time we decided to remove a road because it had only a few thousand users a day...what would the community backlash against that look like?

[dunkalunk]

While I can understand the cold rationale of the decision, GRT should have expected community backlash from this and gotten ahead of it instead of being behind it. At the very least, alternates for service on Greenbrook; either or a shorter route, different endpoints, or reduced frequency should have been considered before making the decision to cut.

[ac3r]

Grand River Transit may strike on Monday.

Beginning May 1, UNIFOR Local 4304, representing Grand River Transit and MobilityPLUS operators, MobilityPLUS reservationists, fleet mechanics and service attendants will be in a legal position to strike.

If there is a strike, GRT and MobilityPLUS buses will not run and as a result, customer service centres will be closed.

ION trains will continue to operate.

Transit customers are encouraged to plan ahead, find alternative transportation options and make careful decisions around fare purchasing.

[jeffster]

You know, sometimes we have to make hard choices, so I understand where GRT is coming from.

But it seems that certain things are insulated from hard choices...policing, roads...when was the last time we decided to remove a road because it had only a few thousand users a day...what would the community backlash against that look like?

Sometimes cuts like this are needed. But missing is context regarding Route 2.

Services were limited or non-existent in 2017 March to December, 2018 March to December, 2019 March to December, 2020 January-February and April to November, 2021 - Reduced all year and 2022 March to October.

This was, btw, because of the rebuild of Stirling that was done in sections between 2017 and 2022. Mill to Greenbrook isn't a long drive, yet this was 5 years of construction (2021 there was no work).

People serviced by this route really had no choice but to find alternative methods of transportation, whether that be by moving (some did) or purchasing cars. But you can't expect people to drop everything and start supporting a route like this immediately when it has its first full year of uninterrupted service in 7 years.