Region of Waterloo International Airport - YKF

[creative]

How is a bus travelling on an open road secure? As previously stated we only received digital boarding passes for the bus. After checking in at YYK we received our remaining boarding passes, digital or printed, our choice. We also would have received our luggage tags if we would have had checked luggage so no need to line up for tags in Toronto. No matter how you arrive at the airport you have to drop your bags. As for location of the bus pickup, as others have previously stated, this is considered another stop on your flight. All of the necessary staff and connected computer terminals already exist at YKF so it makes total sense for this to be the departing location for the bus. If you don’t like the service, don’t use it. Lots of other people use this service and love it.

[SammyOES]

I would guess the boarding pass issue is that a human had to verify your ID before giving you a boarding pass to fly. This happens whenever someone in my family switches passports. The bus isn’t actually a flight, so I assume has more relaxed rules. Not really a bus vs no bus thing since either way you needed someone to issue the passport. Although, arguably much nicer in Waterloo.

[creative]

When we fly, we never check in at the desk as we fly carry-on only and always have digital boarding passes. On a number of occasions we have been called to the boarding desk to make sure that we are there and to check our id.

[plam]

The bus isn’t actually a flight, so I assume has more relaxed rules.  Not really a bus vs no bus thing since either way you needed someone to issue the passport.  Although, arguably much nicer in Waterloo.

It is actually true in a surprising way that the bus isn't a flight; I've tried to go through security at YYZ with a bus boarding pass and it isn't in the system. 

I will agree with creative that the bus isn't secure and shouldn't be considered "airside" for security purposes, even if screening were done at YKF.

Bags can arrive at YYZ from connecting flights, though, and I don't know the reason that the bus can't be considered a flight for that purpose.

Annoyingly, it happens all the time that I can't check in online for a 6am flight from Wellington when it's ticketed by Air Canada and operated by Air New Zealand.

[SammyOES]

I understand the reasoning for why the bus isn’t considered secure. But I think it practical terms it could easily be as secure as many other aspects of airport security.

Just as one example, you could have a security seal placed on the doors (passenger and luggage) in Waterloo that triggers electronically and physically breaks if the door is opened. So passengers and luggage loaded on the secure side. Security seals the doors. When arriving in Toronto you pass directly into the secure area if the seals are still in place. The seal doesn’t stop any doors from opening so their is no safety risk in the case of fire or an accident or whatever on the bus.

I’m not saying that’s worth it or not. But if we cared only about true security (and ignored things done for the appearance of security) then I think it’s a pretty easy problem to solve.

[danbrotherston]

I really don't understand why people think that it's possible to secretly board a bus without the driver being aware.

To me, it's plenty secure if the driver is vetted. Even if there was a security breach, it wouldn't happen in secret. And same for baggage. The driver will notice the baggage door being opened.

[plam]

I just found that Lufthansa is operating some buses. Someone on the Internet says that they're not popular between Innsbruck and Munich, which is 2h45 (LH3834). That bus seems to depart from the Innsbruck airport, whose runways are under construction. There is also the "Lufthansa Express Bus" (https://www.lufthansa.com/dk/en/lufthansa-express-bus) which picks up in the city but also requires travellers to go through security at the airport; they'll give priority screening though.

[taylortbb]

Just as one example, you could have a security seal placed on the doors (passenger and luggage) in Waterloo that triggers electronically and physically breaks if the door is opened.  So passengers and luggage loaded on the secure side.  Security seals the doors.  When arriving in Toronto you pass directly into the secure area if the seals are still in place. The seal doesn’t stop any doors from opening so their is no safety risk in the case of fire or an accident or whatever on the bus.

I believe some of the Landline buses in the US operate this way, where you do security at the remote airport and the bus is sealed with a sticker on the outside. It does however require constructing airside bus facilities on both ends, so I understand why Air Canada would start with a simpler process (security at YYZ) before spending millions of dollars on infrastructure. Now that the buses are more popular, and they keep adding YKF departures, I expect they're looking at the cost/benefit of expanding the infrastructure.

Personally, the YKF -> YYZ experience is already great, and doing security at YKF wouldn't really change anything for me. It's the YYZ -> YKF experience that I want improved. Waiting groundside at YYZ with your bags sucks, and I wish the bus departed from the D gates where there's things to do and lounges to wait in. I think they could build a D gate that's basically just a portal through the fence for passengers and bags to exit via, so it would have none of the security considerations and require no infrastructure on the YKF end.

[danbrotherston]

Just as one example, you could have a security seal placed on the doors (passenger and luggage) in Waterloo that triggers electronically and physically breaks if the door is opened.  So passengers and luggage loaded on the secure side.  Security seals the doors.  When arriving in Toronto you pass directly into the secure area if the seals are still in place. The seal doesn’t stop any doors from opening so their is no safety risk in the case of fire or an accident or whatever on the bus.

I believe some of the Landline buses in the US operate this way, where you do security at the remote airport and the bus is sealed with a sticker on the outside. It does however require constructing airside bus facilities on both ends, so I understand why Air Canada would start with a simpler process (security at YYZ) before spending millions of dollars on infrastructure. Now that the buses are more popular, and they keep adding YKF departures, I expect they're looking at the cost/benefit of expanding the infrastructure.

Personally, the YKF -> YYZ experience is already great, and doing security at YKF wouldn't really change anything for me. It's the YYZ -> YKF experience that I want improved. Waiting groundside at YYZ with your bags sucks, and I wish the bus departed from the D gates where there's things to do and lounges to wait in. I think they could build a D gate that's basically just a portal through the fence for passengers and bags to exit via, so it would have none of the security considerations and require no infrastructure on the YKF end.

There will no doubt be some cost for fees at the airport, and the soft infrastructure (processes) would have to be designed and vetted. But the hard (physical) infrastructure needed is basically zero. YKF has no problem discharging passengers to/from the ground. I don't actually know if they have a jet-way at all, but every time I've flown through YKF I've just walked to the plane and boarded going up stairs. There's no reason that couldn't literally be a bus instead. On the YYZ side, I'm pretty sure they have the ability to do this as well, I've definitely seen it done at other major airports (Detroit, O'Hare).

[creative]

It appears that the Air Canada shuttle bus is operated by a company called The Landline Company. They indicate 12x daily service that you can book independent of an Air Canada flight. Regular price appears to be $49 per person (currently discounted at $39) but I’m not sure if that is return included. Looks like they also offer service from/to other areas as well. For two people at full fare that is about the same as a taxi and that goes door to door. If it wasn’t included in the cost of the airfare I would probably choose a taxi.

[taylortbb]

There will no doubt be some cost for fees at the airport, and the soft infrastructure (processes) would have to be designed and vetted. But the hard (physical) infrastructure needed is basically zero. YKF has no problem discharging passengers to/from the ground. I don't actually know if they have a jet-way at all, but every time I've flown through YKF I've just walked to the plane and boarded going up stairs. There's no reason that couldn't literally be a bus instead. On the YYZ side, I'm pretty sure they have the ability to do this as well, I've definitely seen it done at other major airports (Detroit, O'Hare).

YYZ has bus gates, but they're for airside buses that stay permanently within the secure area, and which don't carry luggage (which can have items that prohibited from being in passenger's possession in the secure area). While there are places to get a bus in and out of the secure area, they're not located in places that would make sense for this service. Air side buses also have to talk to ground ATC, and require drivers that are trained and certified for that, which would probably make the service more expensive. YKF would probably be easier to do with current infrastructure, but the ATC communication issue still exists because it would involve driving with planes on an active taxiway.

Could it theoretically be done without any hard infrastructure? Probably yes, but it would be expensive, slow, and operationally cumbersome because the facilities just aren't built for it.

Any realistically operationally feasible way of doing this would likely require building new secure accesses that are better positioned for access to the bus gates, and which don't cross the taxiways.

It appears that the Air Canada shuttle bus is operated by a company called The Landline Company. They indicate 12x daily service that you can book independent of an Air Canada flight. Regular price appears to be $49 per person (currently discounted at $39) but I’m not sure if that is return included. Looks like they also offer service from/to other areas as well. For two people at full fare that is about the same as a taxi and that goes door to door. If it wasn’t included in the cost of the airfare I would probably choose a taxi.

While you can book it independently of an Air Canada flight, last time I looked at the website you had to indicate if you flight was booked with Air Canada or Air Canada Vacations. There was no option for other airlines. Some have gotten away with using it for non-AC flights, but I wouldn't trust it.

[plam]

Three more factoids that I picked up. I should probably be doing my day job instead.

1. Landline is also operating a shuttle from Montreal Trudeau (YUL) to downtown, but that one doesn't seem to have a flight number, costs $9 (less than the 747, but you can't take the metro afterwards without paying), and requires you to be connecting to an AC flight.

2. Landline will do hotel pickups in Niagara (restricted list of hotels). If you have checked luggage, you can put it on the bus at your hotel, but then you have to take it off the bus and then put it on again at YCM. (This answers in part the question of "why don't they do pickups at Kitchener Station" for instance; I guess they could, but they'd have to pass through YKF, and probably judged it not worthwhile).

3. For YKF and other Ontario airports, they now seem to be selling Landline tickets independently and no longer require an AC connection. Though I'd expect that most would buy it in conjunction with their flight.

[Acitta]

International competition heats up to shuttle Waterloo Region passengers to Pearson airport in Toronto

The competition to shuttle passengers between Kitchener and Pearson International Airport in Toronto is heating up.

The Air Canada bus that runs between the main terminal at the Region of Waterloo International Airport and Pearson is now accepting passengers who book online for seats not filled by Air Canada passengers.

German-based FlixBus also shuttles local passengers to Pearson, departing from Conestoga College’s Doon campus or from Kitchener’s downtown. Great Canadian Coaches operates the buses.

Both bus companies take passengers to Terminal 1 at Pearson. Passengers can make their way to Terminal 3 from there, using an airport link.

[panamaniac]

Just because it's not about buses, I'll ask - has Westjet confirmed that flights to YYC will be off the winter schedule?

[nms]

Just because it's not about buses, I'll ask - has Westjet confirmed that flights to YYC will be off the winter schedule?

There is nothing obvious.  A quick Google search just references a potential labour disruption with flight attendants.