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(08-31-2016, 02:51 PM)chutten Wrote: I'm more worried about prevalence of top-up stations. Every mom-and-pop can sell GRT tickets. Hell, my supermarket does.
But I'll bet it won't have a machine that'll take coins and turn it into trips on a card. If I don't have Internet where I live, or a bank account/credit card/etc. ... then how can I use the bus?
Suddenly everything gets harder for the disadvantaged.
I cannot find the citation, but I seem to recall that it was suggested that top up machines would be found fairly universally, not just at GRT facilities, I think supermarkets were explicitly mentioned.
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I think for the top-up machines it's actually a mix of upside and downside for low-income users.
The downside is of course that those which must use cash can only top-up at a top-up machine, which is probably in fewer locations than the number that currently sell bus tickets.
However, I remember reading that one of the highest users of cash fares are low income riders who cannot afford the up-front expense of an entire strip of tickets to access the reduced per-ride rate. As automated top-up machines generally have no minimum top-up for cash, a rider who's received a multi-use card from a social assistance agency now has access to ticket-like reduced fares, while not having to commit the full price of a strip of tickets. This of course depends on there being adequate reload machines, but with them being located at every ION station and major transfer point it will apply to a lot of riders.
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The EasyGO FAQ says that "A minimum amount of $10 must be loaded on the card; therefore you cannot load a single fare ride onto your EasyGO Fare Card. If you wish to ride only once, you may continue to pay cash." Do you think that also applies to top-up machines?
http://www.grt.ca/en/fares/EasyGO-FAQ.asp
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09-01-2016, 04:06 AM
(This post was last modified: 09-01-2016, 04:07 AM by taylortbb.)
I interpreted that as a minimum initial load to get a card, not a restriction on topping up an existing card. I could also see it applying to electronic transactions due to the overhead cost of processing a payment, but don't see why it would apply to cash top-ups.
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(08-31-2016, 06:09 PM)danbrotherston Wrote: I cannot find the citation, but I seem to recall that it was suggested that top up machines would be found fairly universally, not just at GRT facilities, I think supermarkets were explicitly mentioned.
I’ve given tickets to people asking for bus fare on the street, and I’ve seen others do the same. Some people I know do that who would not be comfortable giving cash for their own reasons.
Some households buy strips of tickets to be used by multiple members. I have a neighbour who asks another neighbour for a bus ticket when he takes one of his very seldom bus trips.
These kinds of things are not possible with a fare card.
No matter what, tickets will be more flexible than a pre-loaded card, even if you can preload at very many locations and with no minimum top-up, using any form of money. I still don’t think that’s a strong argument against moving away from tickets, but people of less means will be disadvantaged in some ways that should be mitigated where possible.
Question for anyone who might know: if an EasyGO card is loaded using cash at a machine, is there any requirement to associate a name or any other personal information with that card? For people who buy passes, can the pass be purchased at a kiosk and a receipt provided, again without a name or other information being associated with the card?
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I *think* only discounted fares need any association. So, like the TTC pass, whoever has the card can use it, unless you're loading it with discounted fares.
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For comparison, with Presto, you only need to register a card with a person when you set up discounted passes, or online balance reloading.
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09-01-2016, 12:38 PM
(This post was last modified: 09-01-2016, 12:40 PM by danbrotherston.)
(09-01-2016, 09:26 AM)MidTowner Wrote: (08-31-2016, 06:09 PM)danbrotherston Wrote: I cannot find the citation, but I seem to recall that it was suggested that top up machines would be found fairly universally, not just at GRT facilities, I think supermarkets were explicitly mentioned.
I’ve given tickets to people asking for bus fare on the street, and I’ve seen others do the same. Some people I know do that who would not be comfortable giving cash for their own reasons.
Some households buy strips of tickets to be used by multiple members. I have a neighbour who asks another neighbour for a bus ticket when he takes one of his very seldom bus trips.
These kinds of things are not possible with a fare card.
No matter what, tickets will be more flexible than a pre-loaded card, even if you can preload at very many locations and with no minimum top-up, using any form of money. I still don’t think that’s a strong argument against moving away from tickets, but people of less means will be disadvantaged in some ways that should be mitigated where possible.
Question for anyone who might know: if an EasyGO card is loaded using cash at a machine, is there any requirement to associate a name or any other personal information with that card? For people who buy passes, can the pass be purchased at a kiosk and a receipt provided, again without a name or other information being associated with the card?
In some ways they are less flexible, although not to the degree you describe. I believe a household would be able to share a farecard, although not for traveling together.
I don't know for sure, but I would be very surprised if one needed to provide any ID or personal information to get a card. That would be pretty unusual for a transit system.
And in other ways, the fare cards are more flexible. Right now, if you can't afford a strip of 10 tickets, or don't need 10 tickets, you must pay the higher cash fare. With the fare card, you can pay the lower fare in smaller intervals.
I do agree, I have given people bus tickets before, and that would be much harder to do with a fare card. There are certainly trade offs, but I believe the advantages still outweigh the costs, I would suspect, even for the less fortunate.
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As for top-up machines, I beleive Presto has automated units and I am hopeful EasyGo will do the same. We may even see them on Ion platforms, major bus hubs like the Boardwalk, etc.
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09-01-2016, 10:31 PM
(This post was last modified: 09-01-2016, 10:31 PM by taylortbb.)
(09-01-2016, 01:45 PM)KevinL Wrote: As for top-up machines, I beleive Presto has automated units and I am hopeful EasyGo will do the same. We may even see them on Ion platforms, major bus hubs like the Boardwalk, etc.
Automated top-up machines are definitely in the contract for every ION station platform. Given that I'll be pretty surprised if they aren't also at major bus hubs.
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Cambridge Centre terminal update!
Driver's Lounge
Expanded walkway to the mall
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09-05-2016, 08:20 PM
(This post was last modified: 09-05-2016, 08:35 PM by dunkalunk.)
Did anyone else notice that they changed the font on GRT bus destination signs? I asked a driver and he confirmed they changed in on Sunday. They appear to show a larger, non-shifting route number. There also appears to be more emphasis on the name of the route and less on the destination. I'll post a picture once I get one tomorrow unless someone beats me to it.
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(09-05-2016, 08:20 PM)dunkalunk Wrote: Did anyone else notice that they changed the font on GRT bus destination signs? I asked a driver and he confirmed they changed in on Sunday. They appear to show a larger, non-shifting route number. There also appears to be more emphasis on the name of the route and less on the destination. I'll post a picture once I get one tomorrow unless someone beats me to it.
Yes I have noticed this too! So far I'm really liking this change and find it easier to understand.
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(09-05-2016, 08:20 PM)dunkalunk Wrote: Did anyone else notice that they changed the font on GRT bus destination signs? I asked a driver and he confirmed they changed in on Sunday. They appear to show a larger, non-shifting route number. There also appears to be more emphasis on the name of the route and less on the destination. I'll post a picture once I get one tomorrow unless someone beats me to it.
They started popping up last week. New signs now have two exposures, rotating between "# ROUTE NAME" in all cap and "# D ESTINATION" in small cap format. Looks good and more standardized across the network. I Wouldn't say that the emphasis is more on the destination, though.
Example:
20 VICTORIA-FREDERICK / 20 T O T HE B OARDWALK
34 BINGEMANS / 34 T O C HARLES T ERMINAL
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Ehhhhhh, I really hate that. I actually just cringed. Why can't it be mixed-case Helvetica?
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