ION - Waterloo Region's Light Rail Transit

[Canard]

It happened again today.

[Pheidippides]

I was surprised the recent deaths in Edmonton and Calgary were not bigger news here as a warning to others.

[panamaniac]

It happened again today.

What happened?

[Canard]

After hearing on the radio last week that the LRT had to hit the emergency brake because of trespassers on the track, this image is perfect, lol

[Canard]

I was surprised the recent deaths in Edmonton and Calgary were not bigger news here as a warning to others.

It happens all the time.

It's what happens when you decide that you want to run trains at ground level in an urban environment (instead of burying them or putting them in the air, where they should be).

[ijmorlan]

I was surprised the recent deaths in Edmonton and Calgary were not bigger news here as a warning to others.

It happens all the time.

It's what happens when you decide that you want to run trains at ground level in an urban environment (instead of burying them or putting them in the air, where they should be).

I’m not sure why you think trains should be grade-separated, but having roads at-grade is just peachy keen. As long as the total number of deaths per passenger mile is much lower than it is for road/bus transportation then there really isn’t much to be done — there is no reason why trains should be expected to be safer than anything else in our society, and at a certain point it’s way easier to reduce deaths by making something else safer rather than picking on trains.

I should also point out that one needs to look at the circumstances of whatever deaths occur to understand what is really going on. Consider two scenarios. In both there is a long narrow railway bridge crossing a river. Every so often somebody dies crossing it on foot. The first bridge has a purpose-built pedestrian bridge right next to it. The other does not, and in fact is the only way across the river for miles around, with a low-income residential area on one side and an important shopping and employment area on the other side.

In the first case, the people crossing it are just being stupid and dangerous. There is absolutely no reason for them to be on the bridge since they could use the pedestrian bridge that has been built for that purpose. These people, or their statistical equivalents, will kill themselves doing something dumb somewhere. So trying to squeeze every last bit of danger out of the rail infrastructure will not really help much.

In the second case, while the danger level is the same, the real problem is the lack of appropriate transportation links; and it’s very easy for a privileged person with a car to say “don’t walk on the rail tracks” but back in the real world people trying to hold down 3 jobs sometimes do what they have to do in order to keep their lives from falling apart entirely. In this case, it makes sense to reduce the danger by improving infrastructure; but note that the required improvement is not enhanced measures to keep people off the tracks but rather a parallel bridge to take the pedestrian traffic.

[creative]

"privileged person with a car" WOW!!!

[Markster]

It is entirely unsurprising that there are people on the tracks when they build crossings that force you out of your way:

   

Or just forget to build crossings at all:

   

"privileged person with a car" WOW!!!

Yes, having a car is a privilege. One that many people do not have.

[creative]

So all people that own cars are "privileged people" and some how look down on people who do not and are therefore branded elitists!

[Canard]

Yeah, it’s a very tiresome thing to keep hearing about how evil I am just because I like to leave the city and explore the rest of the continent.

[KevinT]

So all people that own cars are "privileged people" and some how look down on people who do not and are therefore branded elitists!

Not all, but anecdotally I'd say more than half.  I see it in Facebook posts and hear it in regular conversation every day from people who never have and probably never will take transit because they've had access to a car since their 16th birthday.

[danbrotherston]

Having a privilege is not evil nor elitist.

Owning a car is a privilege, but it doesn't make you bad or good, it's what you choose to do with that privilege that matters.  If you refuse to acknowledge it as an advantage, and act as though others who don't have that advantage don't exist, or are bad because of their actions that result from not having a car, that's not a good thing.

If you recognize that you have a privilege and seek to enable those who don't to enjoy some of the same benefits you enjoy because of your privilege, well that is a good thing.

And there are vast swaths of middle ground where we're all just people who live our lives and are neither good nor bad.

ijmorlan's example may have seemed slanted, but only because it challenges the idea that we should blame people who are taking a shortcut, when we enjoy the privilege of a transportation system that largely (and I say this as a pedestrian and cyclist, who is privileged to live downtown) works for us.  Other's may not have that advantage and may find it harder to get where they need to go.  I certainly feel this any time I leave the relatively pedestrian and transit friendly downtown cores.

When people get all defensive about their privileges being pointed out, it's an indicator that they feel guilty about them, which just isn't right...I feel no guilt about the many privileges I enjoy being a straight white male in North America, but it does open my eyes to the fact that other's don't have those advantages, and that I should seek to enable others who lack them to succeed as I am able to, partly through my own abilities, but also through the advantages I was born with.

[ijmorlan]

So all people that own cars are "privileged people" and some how look down on people who do not and are therefore branded elitists!

Please make an effort to understand what the other person is saying. No one could reasonably in good faith read what I wrote and conclude that I thought all cars owners looked down on others.

But as to the specific issue, yes, car ownership marks one as a relatively privileged person compared to the majority who do not have a car (probably not a majority in this country, but world wide certainly, and even here a larger fraction than is commonly and implicitly assumed). Not the same kind of privilege as possessed by royalty or multi-billionaires, obviously, but being able to make an appointment across town on a moment’s notice by just popping in the car and driving over there does in fact make one privileged. Even “just” needing to go to a medical appointment across town can be a significant hardship for somebody with extremely limited resources.

[ijmorlan]

Yeah, it’s a very tiresome thing to keep hearing about how evil I am just because I like to leave the city and explore the rest of the continent.

Please make an effort to understand what the other person is saying. No one could reasonably in good faith read what I wrote and conclude that I thought you were evil because you like travelling. A made-up exaggeration at that level deserves an apology.

[Rainrider22]

Having a privilege is not evil nor elitist.

Owning a car is a privilege, but it doesn't make you bad or good, it's what you choose to do with that privilege that matters.  If you refuse to acknowledge it as an advantage, and act as though others who don't have that advantage don't exist, or are bad because of their actions that result from not having a car, that's not a good thing.

If you recognize that you have a privilege and seek to enable those who don't to enjoy some of the same benefits you enjoy because of your privilege, well that is a good thing.

And there are vast swaths of middle ground where we're all just people who live our lives and are neither good nor bad.

ijmorlan's example may have seemed slanted, but only because it challenges the idea that we should blame people who are taking a shortcut, when we enjoy the privilege of a transportation system that largely (and I say this as a pedestrian and cyclist, who is privileged to live downtown) works for us.  Other's may not have that advantage and may find it harder to get where they need to go.  I certainly feel this any time I leave the relatively pedestrian and transit friendly downtown cores.

When people get all defensive about their privileges being pointed out, it's an indicator that they feel guilty about them, which just isn't right...I feel no guilt about the many privileges I enjoy being a straight white male in North America, but it does open my eyes to the fact that other's don't have those advantages, and that I should seek to enable others who lack them to succeed as I am able to, partly through my own abilities, but also through the advantages I was born with.

Just to be clear,  I have worked my ass off my whole life to attain what some people label privilege.  I own a car, a truck, two motorcycles, as modes of transportation. I have never felt guilty about my achievements nor will I ever as I don't subscribe to much of the rhetoric about privilege.   I do however volunteer a lot of hours back to my community, I have raised thousands of dollars towards various charities as an example of how people give back in different ways.  Now on the part of public transportation,  I have endorsed and advocated LRT right from the start including going to the first original workshops.  I do it because I recognize it is for the good of our community at large and for the future of my children.  I think everyone needs to get off their high horses and stop judging people period.  Actions speak louder than words.  I think ijmorlan's did a great job describing the realities of how people view public transportation, and I did not take exception to his choice of words because I looked at the bigger message he was trying to convey..  Anyways,  just my thoughts on the matter...  Good discussion guys...