Ending Chronic Homelessness

[neonjoe]

Yea I can see how that can get tricky, ideally it would be some sort of housing - actually, how is the Big Tent City (I'm not sure that's the proper name) on Ardelt doing? Can the city do something like that?

The Region also did open up the second micro home site up near the Paramedic Headquarters after the initial court case. A Better Tent City is run by a volunteer organization on land donated by the WRDSB. I believe that the organization running the one on the region's land at the Paramedic headquarters is the Working Centre.
That being said, the micro home communities have similar rules and restrictions to shelters, the individual has to want to follow these rules to live in these places for the safety of all the residents. Some of the residents at Victora/Weber do not trust the system or want to abide by the rules placed on them. In those cases should the region be forced to provide a space that could be potentially harmful to the individual or there residents.
It's likely a losing battle either way for the cities/region. If they could at least have enough spaces for the individuals who would follow the rules it would be great and if there were provincial support to get the ones who need the mental/psychological health resources to be in a state to actually desire to follow the rules for the spaces it would be even better.
I'm a firm believer that Mental Health should be covered in the same was a Medical Health...

[dtkvictim]

I'm a firm believer that Mental Health should be covered in the same was a Medical Health...

Don't worry, we are working hard towards parity by reducing the state of medical healthcare to match the state of mental health coverage!

[bravado]

It's likely a losing battle either way for the cities/region. If they could at least have enough spaces for the individuals who would follow the rules it would be great and if there were provincial support to get the ones who need the mental/psychological health resources to be in a state to actually desire to follow the rules for the spaces it would be even better.

This is the real kicker... as usual, the province is letting cities do all the work and foot the bill for things that should be managed from the top and actually funded by governments that have the ability to fund them. Doug Ford gets to spend nothing and dodge all the blame and let City Hall waste their time flailing in the courts and taking all the blame. The scale of the housing and addiction and mental health crises is so large that there's no way a city or region could even begin to tackle it independently, and yet that's exactly what we have in Ontario.

[nms]

There is hope that the tide may yet turn.  The provincial legislature recently reinstated pensions for sitting MPPs which were cut in 1995 as part of the first wave of Mike Harris' "Common Sense Revolution".  The issue came to a head when it was revealed that former long-serving Scarborough MPP Lorenzo Berardinetti was homeless.  Maybe Doug Ford will surprise us yet (or perhaps the Province will end up in court on the wrong end of a lawsuit from the Association of Canadian Municipalities who lay the Provincial duties and responsibilities back at the Provincial doorstep).

[creative]

The biggest problem is that a certain segment can’t/won’t take the housing when offered.

[tomh009]

Another ABTC (or the expansion of the existing one) would be a better solution in many ways, and still relatively quick. And not all that expensive, either.

[danbrotherston]

The biggest problem is that a certain segment can’t/won’t take the housing when offered.

This isn’t “the biggest problem”. I’m not saying these people don’t exist—we had people who were homeless prior to the current crisis but the vast vast majority of unhoused people today are not in that group of people. Don’t use the existence of a few people in that situation as a justification for not solving the very real problems causing most homelessness.

[Rainrider22]

The biggest problem is that a certain segment can’t/won’t take the housing when offered.

This isn’t “the biggest problem”. I’m not saying these people don’t exist—we had people who were homeless prior to the current crisis but the vast vast majority of unhoused people today are not in that group of people. Don’t use the existence of a few people in that situation as a justification for not solving the very real problems causing most homelessness.

Actually Dan, not wanting to live in provided shelters is actually a large part of the problem.  Clients have to agree to certain rules to live in shelters. Most people either choose not to abide by the rules, or due to addictions and mental health issues they are unable to reside in the shelters. As someone who works in a field that regularly deals with homeless people, I have first hand knowledge.

[danbrotherston]

This isn’t “the biggest problem”. I’m not saying these people don’t exist—we had people who were homeless prior to the current crisis but the vast vast majority of unhoused people today are not in that group of people. Don’t use the existence of a few people in that situation as a justification for not solving the very real problems causing most homelessness.

Actually Dan, not wanting to live in provided shelters is actually a large part of the problem.  Clients have to agree to certain rules to live in shelters. Most people either choose not to abide by the rules, or due to addictions and mental health issues they are unable to reside in the shelters. As someone who works in a field that regularly deals with homeless people, I have first hand knowledge.

I’ll admit I may have misinterpreted creatives statement to mean “won’t take any housing when offered”. I don’t really consider a shelter as “housing”.  I do agree that a larger number of people won’t stay in a shelter (although I’d say it’s not just unwillingness to follow the rules). But I still don’t think this is the “biggest problem” nor do I think it is actually a majority.

The main point: it is wrong to say the biggest problem lies with unhoused people. They have the least power in this situation. I don’t think we should point out the problematic minority and hold them up as an obstacle to helping people.

[creative]

This thread was in discussion regarding the habitants of the tent city on Victoria and how the majority are living with some form of mental illness. My statement was in reference to this site and these habitants. These observations are based on discussion with a social worker who tries to find any alternative to living in a tent. This is also based on a family member who is unable to accept living anywhere with any type of rules. Yes there are many contributing factors to those living homeless or underused but in the case of this site, that is the biggest problem.

[bravado]

I think we can agree that a certain proportion of homeless people don't want the solutions offered - sometimes for rational reasons, and a lot of times for irrational reasons.

Anyone who can come up with an answer of "what to do" with these people that doesn't involve jail would be quite a hero in lots of jurisdictions.

I genuinely don't know what to do with people who fall too far through the cracks. All I know is how to fill some of those cracks to stop that stream of ruined lives, but the ones who are lost seem to be truly lost and it stresses me out thinking about it.

[Kodra24]

I think we can agree that a certain proportion of homeless people don't want the solutions offered - sometimes for rational reasons, and a lot of times for irrational reasons.

Anyone who can come up with an answer of "what to do" with these people that doesn't involve jail would be quite a hero in lots of jurisdictions.

I genuinely don't know what to do with people who fall too far through the cracks. All I know is how to fill some of those cracks to stop that stream of ruined lives, but the ones who are lost seem to be truly lost and it stresses me out thinking about it.

Is there anything other countries (thinking Scandinavia) have done to address this particular issue? Or is there far fewer of them to begin with and it's not really an issue there...

[tomh009]

So how do we deal with the fringe segment of our homeless population that are dealing with mental issues.

There is no denying that some of the homeless have mental health issues and/or dependencies on illicit drugs.

And yet, here I am, visiting Finland, and there is nary a homeless person on the streets of the country's largest cities. Could it be that "Housing First" really works?

I'm just going to quote my post from a few weeks ago. "Housing First" really does work. Give people their (own) housing--not a shelter bed--and things can start turning around for a lot of people. It does take some money and political will, though.

[Momo26]

There was some research done to show how a tremendous difference simply having a very modest place to call home can make for someone. Iirc some documentary showcased small 150sqft type modular homes with a bed, kitchen and washroom in one got people on their feet as they started working again and having purpose.

With the millions spent on doing whatever jt is that is done to support them, can we not build a row of 150 to 200 micro units and when someone is working, by month 2 they start contributing to the costs of upkeep

[tomh009]

There was some research done to show how a tremendous difference simply having a very modest place to call home can make for someone. Iirc some documentary showcased small 150sqft type modular homes with a bed, kitchen and washroom in one got people on their feet as they started working again and having purpose.

With the millions spent on doing whatever jt is that is done to support them, can we not build a row of 150 to 200 micro units and when someone is working, by month 2 they start contributing to the costs of upkeep

Even the ABTC units are a step in the right direction: it's feasible to live in one and actually work. Doing that while sleeping in a tent or a doorway, not so much.