ION - Waterloo Region's Light Rail Transit

[Canard]

Yup. I hadn’t turned on 570 News since the election on my drive to work, and for whatever reason I turned it on this morning and almost instantly turned it off. The headline Glenn was shouting was “WELL, BOMBARDIER FAILS YET AGAIN!” or something to that avail. I have no use for it. Life is too short.

When you ask your contractor to build you a kitchen, except you want to pick the sink... and then you don’t pick the sink, and then when you finally do, and the maker of the sink makes it from scratch to suit your countertop, and hasn’t yet issued it to them to install... who’s fault is it that the kitchen isn’t done on time?

[KevinT]

When you ask your contractor to build you a kitchen, except you want to pick the sink... and then you don’t pick the sink, and then when you finally do, and the maker of the sink makes it from scratch to suit your countertop, and hasn’t yet issued it to them to install... who’s fault is it that the kitchen isn’t done on time?

Exactly.  Well said!

[jason897]

When you ask your contractor to build you a kitchen, except you want to pick the sink... and then you don’t pick the sink, and then when you finally do, and the maker of the sink makes it from scratch to suit your countertop, and hasn’t yet issued it to them to install... who’s fault is it that the kitchen isn’t done on time?

it's Bombardier's fault, obviously XD

[timc]

When you ask your contractor to build you a kitchen, except you want to pick the sink... and then you don’t pick the sink, and then when you finally do, and the maker of the sink makes it from scratch to suit your countertop, and hasn’t yet issued it to them to install... who’s fault is it that the kitchen isn’t done on time?

Wait, I know this. The sink was picked first, and the rest of the kitchen was built around it. Sure, the faucet was late, and was found to be defective, but why wasn't the sink installed already?

[darts]

Is it grandlinq or the region who hasn't decided on these last minute items? If so they won't be stepping up to say they are the reason for the delay instead of bombardier

[Canard]

The Region.

Requisite “My Understanding”:

Metrolinx screwed us over by not developing the custom in-cab signalling system they said they would for the Crosstown.

So, things got left until someone finally said “um, guys, there’s still that hole in the dash. What are we doing here?”

Since the Region is doing the procurement, they had to scramble to try and get someone else to do it. So, they did, and then tried to install it themselves, and couldn’t. So, they gave up, and asked Bombardier to do it for them. And now they are scrambling to do it for us... and everyone is taking a dump on them they’re the bad guys.

If you want to point fingers, the blame is squarely on Metrolinx... and The Region for quietly allowing Bombardier to take the heat. They can’t call out Metrolinx, because the funding for part of our line comes from the Province. But who cares about some company that can’t publically defend itself?

All the public see is no trains, and the media is all-too-happy to play right into that and just blindly spew this smear crap that couldn’t be further from the truth. It breaks my heart to see people doing this so maliciously.

[jamincan]

Usually in situations like this, things are not so black and white. There is usually plenty of blame to share.

I also don't think it's fair to say that the region is dumping on Bombardier. The media certainly is, but it isn't the responsibility of the region to defend poor little Bombardier.

Re: the in cab signaling. When did the info regarding the region trying and failing to develop a solution get released? I think this is the first I've heard of it.

[Canard]

Black and white would be what the media is repeating. I shed a fair bit of colour in my post above.

Requisite “My Understanding”:

You misunderstood my post - the Region didn’t fail to develop the system, there were challenges installing the off-the-shelf system they eventually bought, because Metrolinx didn’t provide the one they said they would. So when they realized it didn’t make sense for them to install it, they reached out to the vehicle manufacturer to take over that part.

This was a logical conclusion - but one that should have been made years, not a few months, ago. They (The Region) never would have been in that scenario if a) Metrolinx had been truthful that they had no intention of developing the in-cab signaling system on their own, or on time, or b) told the Region at the time of order they’d be responsible for that component, where they might have simply gone with Bombardier’s stock system.

We’d have an integrated solution, instead of this patchwork mess.

I’ll send you a PM privately about your last comment.

[SammyOES]

Why can't Bombardier defend itself?

It feels like its pretty common for companies to explain when things aren't their fault and give more details on the delays.

[Canard]

Because they risk pissing off the Region (their current customer), or the Province (and risk losing future orders).

[bgb_ca]

It appears that Bombardier did actually say something

https://www.kitchenertoday.com/local-new...rns-970759

[SammyOES]

But by staying silent if they're completely blameless means they risk losing a lot of future customers.  It just seems weird to me that they're taking it so quietly if they really have no share of the blame themselves.

Edit: I'm not saying they're not blameless either. I just find the idea that they're a defenseless public company strange. But I get that these things are full of politics and internal context that we'll just never know. So just because I don't understand doesn't mean they're not acting totally rationally.

[robdrimmie]

Still have my fingers crossed opening gets bumped to Spring 2019; absolutely do not want opening day to be in the winter (so gross!!).  Have been dreaming of this day for years, we don't need it ruined by having it happen in a snowstorm.

I disagree with this quite a bit. I'll be a regular user of the LRT in the winter months, and I want it as soon as possible. If the system is ready to go holding off for more months for aesthetic reasons makes no sense to me. Let's get this thing going so I and other users can benefit from it!

Also I like snow, I don't think that ruins it at all. Terribly snowy days are the best days to take advantage of transit. And December is usually often clear and bright.

[Canard]

Rob: You can disagree all you want - I shared my personal desire, I didn’t state a fact. I said I want a spring opening, not a winter one. I never suggested simply allowing the system to sit idle - I said I kind of hoped things dragged on which would necessitate pushing the launch back until spring.

Sammy: You got your wish regarding a response:

https://www.kitchenertoday.com/local-new...rns-970759

[ijmorlan]

But by staying silent if they're completely blameless means they risk losing a lot of future customers.  It just seems weird to me that they're taking it so quietly if they really have no share of the blame themselves.

Edit: I'm not saying they're not blameless either.  I just find the idea that they're a defenseless public company strange.  But I get that these things are full of politics and internal context that we'll just never know.  So just because I don't understand doesn't mean they're not acting totally rationally.

Good comment! I will mention that Bombardier definitely does deserve a significant fraction of the blame — all those production problems were on them, not anybody else — but as far as I can tell this signalling issue is Region/Metrolinx/Ontario. It’s interesting to speculate what would have happened if Bombardier had got its production together on schedule — they would have had complete vehicles in the second half of 2016; would the Region/Metrolinx have moved faster on making sure the signalling was together, or would we have just had a fleet of vehicles sitting in the OMSF with no signalling integration?