Grand River Transit

[KevinL]

 those concerns had mostly been addressed with the extension of route 34 through downtown, down Stirling/greenbrook and to Sunrise Centre

First I've heard of this solution, is there more detail available somewhere?

[dunkalunk]

@Kevin L https://www.grt.ca/en/about-grt/plans-an...djustments

It was mostly a call to action. There were some people who were resorting to ad-hominem attacks against the presenter when they really need to be directing their anger at council, delegating at counsellors who approved the route cut. I don't necessarily blame people that they weren't informed. GRT also did a very poor job of communicating this before the budget approval.

[jeffster]

So, attended the route 2 and 73 cancellation public information session on Zoom. Less about Route 2 since it seems that those concerns had mostly been addressed with the extension of route 34 through downtown, down Stirling/greenbrook and to Sunrise Centre. Lots of personal arguments for why 73 should have been kept and lamenting that 73 never got a "public consultation" before the decision had been made. I raised my hand and reminded people that if they care about transit, then they need to be reviewing the budget and attending planning and works to delegate. We'll see if the recording ever gets posted.

In all honesty, who has time to do that? Certainly no one here noticed that these routes were going to be cancelled, as there was no mention of it until the GRT posted that these routes were being cancelled. It's also silly to expect people to attend every budget session just in case it might affect them. Obviously the intent is to withhold information from the public, otherwise they would have mentioned to the public that during a budget process on this date they'd be discussing changes and cancellation to certain routes. This didn't happen.

We're in the Route 2 area. This entire route has suffered for 5 of the last 6 years without full service March to December because of roadworks because the city is too damned stupid to figure out how to do a job in one go rather than 6 years. Route 2 has been around forever, and certainly not a route you'd expect to be totally cut.

Either way, very few people have the time and energy to attend all of these meetings. This is especially true when these meetings go late into the evening, and you might not have transit to take you back home. Route 73, for example, last run is at 6:15. Anyone relying on that route is going to be walking home if they want to attend a budget session. Route 2's last run is at 9:08, so ditto on that. As for using Zoom, not everyone has a good internet connection (if at all), nor know how to use it.

That is why the GRT and the Region need to communicate with residents the things they have in mind. A simple mailer would be inexpensive, and would have given them the feedback need and perhaps save them the embarrassment of how stupid they are when making decisions.

[ac3r]

But by not informing anyone they get what they want.

[Bytor]

@Kevin L https://www.grt.ca/en/about-grt/plans-an...djustments

It was mostly a call to action. There were some people who were resorting to ad-hominem attacks against the presenter when they really need to be directing their anger at council, delegating at counsellors who approved the route cut. I don't necessarily blame people that they weren't informed. GRT also did a very poor job of communicating this before the budget approval.

That GRT webpage doesn't include the route replacement option, only the cut.

https://pub-regionofwaterloo.escribemeet...2#page=115

TSD-TRS-23-006

[neonjoe]

@Kevin L https://www.grt.ca/en/about-grt/plans-an...djustments

It was mostly a call to action. There were some people who were resorting to ad-hominem attacks against the presenter when they really need to be directing their anger at council, delegating at counsellors who approved the route cut. I don't necessarily blame people that they weren't informed. GRT also did a very poor job of communicating this before the budget approval.

That GRT webpage doesn't include the route replacement option, only the cut.

https://pub-regionofwaterloo.escribemeet...2#page=115

TSD-TRS-23-006

Its listed on the 2023 service changes page

https://www.grt.ca/en/about-grt/plans-an...djustments

[KevinL]

So it's weekdays only, and only 6-10 AM and 2-6 PM. Seems like cold comfort.

Hopefully the runs they do provide prove popular (especially with the Sunrise connection), and they pick up service in response.

[dunkalunk]

So, attended the route 2 and 73 cancellation public information session on Zoom. Less about Route 2 since it seems that those concerns had mostly been addressed with the extension of route 34 through downtown, down Stirling/greenbrook and to Sunrise Centre. Lots of personal arguments for why 73 should have been kept and lamenting that 73 never got a "public consultation" before the decision had been made. I raised my hand and reminded people that if they care about transit, then they need to be reviewing the budget and attending planning and works to delegate. We'll see if the recording ever gets posted.

In all honesty, who has time to do that? Certainly no one here noticed that these routes were going to be cancelled, as there was no mention of it until the GRT posted that these routes were being cancelled. It's also silly to expect people to attend every budget session just in case it might affect them. Obviously the intent is to withhold information from the public, otherwise they would have mentioned to the public that during a budget process on this date they'd be discussing changes and cancellation to certain routes. This didn't happen.

We're in the Route 2 area. This entire route has suffered for 5 of the last 6 years without full service March to December because of roadworks because the city is too damned stupid to figure out how to do a job in one go rather than 6 years. Route 2 has been around forever, and certainly not a route you'd expect to be totally cut.

Either way, very few people have the time and energy to attend all of these meetings. This is especially true when these meetings go late into the evening, and you might not have transit to take you back home. Route 73, for example, last run is at 6:15. Anyone relying on that route is going to be walking home if they want to attend a budget session. Route 2's last run is at 9:08, so ditto on that. As for using Zoom, not everyone has a good internet connection (if at all), nor know how to use it.

That is why the GRT and the Region need to communicate with residents the things they have in mind. A simple mailer would be inexpensive, and would have given them the feedback need and perhaps save them the embarrassment of how stupid they are when making decisions.

The statement as it was said was meant to agitate people into action. GRT completely dropped the ball on communicating this to any of their riders before the decision has been made and they need to be held account for that . Council also needs to be held account for mandating the decision and then approving it. It's not as if the region has an active transit and active transportation advocacy group to do this anymore.

I admittedly found out because I'm nerd and when I get bored I read the headlines of planning and works.

[tomh009]

The statement as it was said was meant to agitate people into action. GRT completely dropped the ball on communicating this to any of their riders before the decision has been made and they need to be held account for that . Council also needs to be held account for mandating the decision and then approving it. It's not as if the region has an active transit and active transportation advocacy group to do this anymore.

Is TriTAG dead?

[taylortbb]

The statement as it was said was meant to agitate people into action. GRT completely dropped the ball on communicating this to any of their riders before the decision has been made and they need to be held account for that . Council also needs to be held account for mandating the decision and then approving it. It's not as if the region has an active transit and active transportation advocacy group to do this anymore.

Is TriTAG dead?

Effectively yes. It was sustained on a core (and largely unchanging) group of volunteers, who a decade ago were young and didn't have a lot of obligations. Now people have families, careers, etc, but we were never successful enough in bringing in new people.

There is currently some discussion about what could be done to revive it, had our first meeting in years last week. But it's still not clear if there's enough people with the time.

[danbrotherston]

Is TriTAG dead?

Effectively yes. It was sustained on a core (and largely unchanging) group of volunteers, who a decade ago were young and didn't have a lot of obligations. Now people have families, careers, etc, but we were never successful enough in bringing in new people.

There is currently some discussion about what could be done to revive it, had our first meeting in years last week. But it's still not clear if there's enough people with the time.

Even people like myself who were never part of TriTAG and were only accused of being a face of TriTAG by members of council have moved on.

[Bytor]

Is TriTAG dead?

Effectively yes. It was sustained on a core (and largely unchanging) group of volunteers, who a decade ago were young and didn't have a lot of obligations. Now people have families, careers, etc, but we were never successful enough in bringing in new people.

There is currently some discussion about what could be done to revive it, had our first meeting in years last week. But it's still not clear if there's enough people with the time.

Not enough of the originals, but what about new people?

Open things up, make an announcement on Twitter, FB, the RM Transit Discord, etc…

[Bob_McBob]

I know there's a "Help Out!" link in one of the menus on the site, but I never really got the impression TriTAG was actively recruiting new members, or I might have made more of an effort. I'm still not really even clear who was behind it other than Mike. I checked the site and Facebook page regularly when they were active, and I've written to council and participated in many EngageWR surveys over the years in large part due to TriTAG. It's telling how people used to be accused of being TriTAG members at council meetings on a regular basis, and I would be sad to see TriTAG completely cease to exist.

[ac3r]

Where there's a will, there's a way? If someone/some people can attempt to organize and bring it - or another iteration - back, then they should. A new iteration would probably be best, though. Something with more willpower, organization and understanding of "branding". TriTAG had a reputation for a reason: they were bloody annoying. You've got to market your message in a proper way so that a broader group of people will become curious of messaging and feel compelled to explore more about what they are seeing. TriTAG was like a Not Just Bikes Discord server of transit nerds...not exactly good at getting a message out to the broader public. Also you'd need good "leadership" or whatever...far too many transit activists are insufferable heh. So you don't want someone who can't read a room, if you know what I mean.

A new group could be a success if they had someone who understood branding correctly. If there was a good group of people with volunteers who - preferably, anyway - had experience in certain things (marketing, transit, architecture, planning, economics, education and heck even memetics, not even joking) then it could be the sort of thing that can change minds about transit in Waterloo Region beyond attending council meetings on Zoom or lurking very niche websites like this. Infographics to get the basic message out with sources, then readers can check it out and form their own opinions. I mean as an example, it's easier to promote biking in a broad way that appeals to all sorts of demographics, rather than waffling on about carbon emissions or how absolutely evil car owners are. I even try to link this place on Reddit a lot, to get people clicking around and finding resources since this is a helpful forum (although whoever the morons are in /r/waterloo love to ban me for shitposting even though it doesn't work - can't stop, won't stop, tho) but really all you need is like a good message, resources for people to understand why transit is worth investing in and way to get it out across various platforms be it Twitter, small local zines, news coverage, petitions, council awareness, in person rally's or even something silly like stickers. It's how you'll find grassroots organizations operating in larger cities and there's no reason why it can't work in apathetic Waterloo Region.

[danbrotherston]

You guys are welcome (and encouraged) to organise, but it isn't something that just happens. People have to actually DO it.